Polaris Media Group publicly linked to Scientology
Since I started blogging about Polaris Media Group, one of the more unbelievable claims I’ve heard has been that Polaris is simply a front for Scientology.
Some of my readers have claimed the allegations have been flatly denied by Polaris executives and others claim that Krider and co. don’t attempt to hide their Scientology links when asked. This thread over at scam.com is a further example of some of the claims that have been made:
The Liberty League “Inner Circle” (most EMC members) and the new owner Shane Krider are Scientologists seeking to climb “thetan” OT levels and obtain OT VIII: Truth Revealed.
Brent Payne and wife (Julia Payne) sold their share to Shane Krider for various reasons, but one main speculation is due to the fact that Shane Krider is only allowing the top trainers of Liberty League International to be trainers if they are trained, pay money, & practice Scientology communication teachings at the L Ron Hubbard Institute.
I mean seriously, it’s Scientology we’re talking about here. Sure half the population might not know the ins and outs of the religion, but thanks to several high profile members and a continuous stream of bizarre news stories, most people know to turn around and run screaming when they see anything associated with them.
If you fall in the other half of the population you might want to read this indepth analysis of Scientology that made Time Magazine’s 1991 May front cover.
Although hugely skeptical, I never ruled out the Scientology link to Polaris but instead waited until I came across something concrete.
Today, that something came along.
Tipped off by reader iwonder it wasn’t long before I had the following screenshot in my hands. What you are seeing here is Polaris Media Group EMC member Shannon Lavenia actively promoting a ‘Productivity Workshop‘ at the Hubbard College of Administration.
The Hubbard College of Administration is an unaccredited ‘education’ institute that “teaches administration using methods developed by Church of Scientology founder, L. Ron Hubbard.” It is run by the World Institute of Scientology Enterprises (WISE) who’s affiliates have been “urged to recruit for Scientology in exchange for money”.
Not being accredited also means that an external independent regulatory body has ever certified the Hubbard College of Administration’s courses or degrees. In essence a degree from them holds about the same worth as a degree from the OzSoapbox School of Magnificence.
This I believe is possibly just the tip of the iceberg. Best case scenario and Shannon is simply attending the workshop for the information being taught still leaves the thought that one of the inner circle members of Polaris is actively utilising Scientology teachings in her business.
What’s more she’s recruiting others to join her.
Shannon’s husband John Lavenia has also allegedly been promoting Scientology too. Reader Shawn has previously pointed out:
Perhaps the loyalist an doubters that own Lavenia’s book integrity is everything should check the additional recommended readings.
On page 193 where he recommends Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard’s ‘The Problem of Work’ or where he quotes Hubbard on page 158 or visit johnlavenia.com for more recommended readings where he will sell you and any other sucker a copy of teh (sic) Scientology books he recommends.
Back in August I wrote about the departure from Liberty League of Michael Hamburger and Rhonda Swan. Despite being high up in the Liberty League chain it appeared the two had jumped ship for Lifepath Unlimited (a similar company to Polaris).
Whilst the exact reasons Hamburger and Swan left (I assumed it was to do with earnings and the pending changeover to Polaris) were never made public, the scam.com thread I linked to at the beginning of this post states:
Brent Payne’s sister Leslie (Michael Hamburger’s wife) decided to join Life Path Inc. another personal development Home Business due to the fact that she herself (an EMC member) did not want to become a Scientologist and lead an organization of people down the road of Scientology.
Recently prominent EMC member Wendy Stevens also quit Polaris Media. I have read rumours she too has gone over to Lifepath (Update 23/10/2009: this has now been confirmed) and thus far the only publicly available information I’ve been able to find is this press release:
Wendy Stevens, who knows what it’s like to walk on and win, after nearly two years of preparation, is launching her new book, Walk On, and retiring from her full-time network marketing career.
Stevens has signed a book deal with the Resolute Creative agency to launch her next title Walk On, and to pursue her passion to teach, train, coach and mentor individuals to live their best life.
Well your guess is as good as mine however I do think it’s one of the following two reasons, perhaps even both.
a. The money just wasn’t there for her in Polaris’ new compensation plan. Let’s face it, you don’t just up and leave if you’re truly onto a good thing.
b. She came to the same conclusion Hamburger and Swan did and chose not to be involved in Scientology.
Either reason spells bad news for existing associates as they’re either working towards a path in Scientology or actively promoting a business that isn’t as lucrative or profitable as they might have thought.
The link between Scientology and Polaris Media Group is now concrete. How deep it goes is yet to be determined but the more I scratch around the less crazy the rumours seem to get. I’m not saying everything written about Liberty League/Polaris and Scientology is factual but there certainly seems to be more weight to the claims then I originally thought.
Scientology teachings don’t exactly strike me as something you can do without any involvement in the religion. If EMC members are promoting Scientology courses and literature then I can’t help but wonder just how far deep the connection goes within the Polaris organisation.
October 23rd, 2009 at 3:20 am Anon(Quote)
Hi,
Saw your post. I haven’t dug into Polaris Media Group at all. But when businesses are mixed up with Scientology it is usually through a program called WISE “World Institute of Scientology Enterprises”. Their goal is to promote LRH Tech in businesses. Execusoft (the maker of diskeeper) is one of the more well know ones.
WISE tries to target small business owners. Especially chiropractors, dentists, mom & pop auto shops etc.
They offer their services as a way to increase sales & profitability of a business. It isn’t mentioned to the suckers that they are starting on Scientology programming.
Down the road in the program it will eventually lead to sending the small business owner down to the local scientology org for some sort of training to deal with personal issues. They eventually convince the business owner that they need to send all of their employees to either disguised WISE training or out right scientology training programs. Of course those who don’t follow the game plan shouldn’t be trusted & should be fired.
You can find out a little bit more about wise by visiting http://www.stop-wise.biz
Or if you have questions about Scientology &/or WISE feel free to stop by http://forums.whyweprotest.net and perhaps someone there can answer them.
BTW – Good research.
October 23rd, 2009 at 4:04 am Liz(Quote)
Welcome down the rabbit hole of the $ci-cult Oz.
It goes deep.
Beware of becoming a target of their “fair game” policy by revealing too much though.
October 23rd, 2009 at 5:28 am also the truth(Quote)
for proof that Steven has jumoed to Lifepath have a look at this
http://www.radiolifepath.com
October 23rd, 2009 at 7:12 am Sara(Quote)
I thought Wendy Stevens was one of the owners of UWS…..why would she walk away from that money ?
October 23rd, 2009 at 7:50 am iwonder(Quote)
Everything is publicly available.
Oz,
Thankyou for posting this.
I am doing some more research, and I persoanlly believe this goes alot deeper.
Shall be in touch..
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:09 am iwonder(Quote)
Polaris Media group banging on about the north star “your one true north”
http://www.youtube.com/user/PolarisMediaGroup
Definition of “Polaris” as the north star
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polaris
Story from Today Tonight in Feb, stating a recording from L Ron Hubbard before he died. He lets us know that the planet all humans are apparently from is one of the planets of the north star.
http://au.todaytonight.yahoo.com/article/5300692/none/world-exclusive-scientology-alien-secret-exposed
Crikey…..
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:17 am er(Quote)
So interesting and quite scary. John Lavenia is one of the key writers of the New Beyond Freedom Evolution. So glad to be out of this business ($20 000 down). Feel like a sucker. Trying hard to get my money back! Interesting Wendy Stevens is gone!
October 23rd, 2009 at 9:03 am iwonder(Quote)
I am sure she has her reasons.
Perhaps it is because of the very reason this thread has started?
Perhaps the “money” is now alot less?
Who knows?
October 23rd, 2009 at 10:53 am Damon(Quote)
This is hilarious. Polaris and Scientology being “linked” by someone who obviously knows next to nothing about either.
I experimented with Scientology about 28 years ago – got too crazy for me real quick. But I learned enough to know that what PMG promotes and Scientology teaches are about as firmly linked as are apples and watermelons.
And I know Wendy personally – the residual income she’d built under the Polaris plan enabled her to retire and pursue something she’s always wanted to do – isn’t that the whole point of a home-based business?
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:09 am Richard Baldock(Quote)
Much like a trashy tabloid, it seems to me that you will find any seed to plant which you can sensationalise to self promote yourself as the savior of all for everything and anything you can possibly build a story around. Regardless of the truth in a matter, you seem to take selective snippets of information, collectively assemble and publish them and suddenly you have an apparently convincing argument. Tom Cruise is a senior Scientologist but does that impact his acting? So what if someone is into Scientology it doesn’t make them less of a person, unless you want it to. Misinformation or only ‘half a story’ seems a common theme here, and that is irresponsible.
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:17 am iwonder(Quote)
Richard, people do not like being lied to.
Had I of known that Polaris was linked to this cult, I would have never stayed on with them.
The same as many many others who are now finding out I imagine…
The proof that Polaris Media Group is now publicly linked with Scientology is not really half a story.
Of course, if you have further to add…?
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:25 am er(Quote)
Shane Krieder told me himself that he and John Lavenia have written the new Beyond Freedom Evolution. This is extremely concerning when people are unaware they are being influence by the beliefs of Scientologists. It is devious. I have no problems with Scientologists but when you are taught there practices in this way it is wrong.
Richard what is irresponsible about being informed with the truth. Obviously you are still under the spell. (I was)
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:33 am Vince(Quote)
You’re right, being a Scientologist doesn’t impact on his acting.
But, assuming this article is true, being a Scientologist WILL impact on your Polaris Media Group experience and will help you to climb the PMG ladder.
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:37 am Richard Baldock(Quote)
You’re missing the point. The fact that you throw bits of information onto a blog post does NOT make it the truth. The only fact seems to be you create controversy out of very little. People feed of sensationalism, that’s a fact – look at any high ranking news story – the worse or more extreme it is, the more popular it becomes. You are simply creating attention the same as any other news service does – looking for the most negative angle and hyping it up. People act on information. If you control the information, you influence these actions. On the basis you are mis-informing people, that’s irresponsible.
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:44 am Vince(Quote)
Richard, what misinformation exactly? Be specific.
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:44 am Richard Baldock(Quote)
Have you seen the movie “Conspiracy Theory”. might be a good eye opener….
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:46 am Richard Baldock(Quote)
Someone using a Scientology building, and suddenly thery’re a Scientologist recruiting everyone into it. Firstly – thats inconclusive, secondly so what? Its not illegal.
October 23rd, 2009 at 11:50 am Vince(Quote)
Getting very defensive there Richard. I guess it’s because your website freedomisit.com forwards straight to PMG’s. Makes sense now
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:02 pm Richard Baldock(Quote)
Of course, I am defending objectivity. You’re promoting your subjectivity with whatever spin you can create. Either you have a personal axe to grind, with PMG or Scientology, or maybe just the next thing that comes along you want to blame for your latest problem. I have been successful in everything I’ve ever done. Perhaps that’s because I accept responsibility, take accountability and do whatever it takes to make it work, rather than search for faults and looking to blame.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:03 pm iwonder(Quote)
“So what?”
Yet another perfect example of the Polaris mentality.
It is all making sense now in regard to why these so called “inspirational movies” that were supposed to be on tv “everyehere” are few and far between, if seen at all.
If the main aganda is to recruit new members….. and the EMC are being compensated by the church Scientology for doing so…. well I guess the recruits making money would be a secondary focus?
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:08 pm iwonder(Quote)
If you accept responsibility, accept that you have mislead people.
Accept that the organisation you represent has put hundreds (thousands?) of people into finacial difficulty that will for some take years to remedy.
Accpet that Polaris even if it was not linked to Scientology (which it now publicly is) is an extremely flawed system set up to benefit those at the top of the pyramid only.
Accept that 85% of people in the company YOU REPRESENT end up losing money and not making a cent.
Above all this, I find it very interesting (but not surprising) that someone defending Scientology so much has a site linked with Polaris?
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:11 pm Richard Baldock(Quote)
If you want to go on a crusade against Scientology or PMG, then say so and why. Its obviously something you perceive to be negative, but be open with the actual reasons. If someone else is it in to it or anything else, that’s not illegal then why does bother you so much? Sour Grapes perhaps. They have got something you want and you don’t like that?
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:14 pm Richard Baldock(Quote)
If you believe that, then you must also conclude that the free market system across the entire world is flawed. The ratio within that system is way worse that the numbers you present. It grinds you that you are in the lower percentile and have to Soapbox your sad story. Sensationalism sells, and that’s all your doing.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:17 pm Fred(Quote)
I have been watching this debate. It’s great! I do think Richard has some good points. The others seem to be caught up in knocking things rather than a positive contribution.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:21 pm iwonder(Quote)
Ok let’s spell it out for Richard as he is having a little trouble.
People have been misled.
Polaris would have lost many of it’s recruits if they had known of it’s links with a religion (?) such as Scientology (hence the EMC not telling them, and ignoring or deleting questions in that regard).
Also (and this will be the main one for alot of the people who will now leave) – the financial “opportunity” for recruits is NOT the focus now. Which is the reason why most people join- let’s be honest here. It sure isn’t the products..
And you say it is sour grapes when the company YOU represent has hurt so many people?
Richard, you are quite obviously an advocate of Scientology and Polaris, and just one of them would be hard to leave after a serious dose of brainwashing (cash if you are one of the few at the top ripping people off) so obviously this thread annoys you.
And you know what?
That’s good.
The more you write and get defensive, the more you show the link between Scientology and PMG.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:26 pm er(Quote)
Watch it Richard! Your not being a good PMGer as you are told not to debate on these forums! Go do you Beyond Freedom and follow the cult.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:27 pm James Larson(Quote)
My name is James Larson and I am on the Executive Leadership Team with Life Path Unlimited. I was a former top earner with LLI and have been with Life Path Unlimited for 11 months. I love everything that I have seen here, especially the products. Life Path gives a money back guarantee on their initial product backed by the company. It is true that Wendy Stevens has joined forces with Life Path Unlimited, she has already been on two of our training calls and plans on taking over the monday night Think and Grow Rich Mastermind. You can go to http://RadioLifePath.com to hear for your own ears.
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:28 pm er(Quote)
Thank you so much Oz. You are making a difference!
October 23rd, 2009 at 12:37 pm Richard(Quote)
I am only defending a holistic purveying of information. I would have to say its the other way around. What will be tomorrow’s blame storm? They are always (at least) two sides to every story. Given you’re seeking to attract public attention you should probably come clean.
October 23rd, 2009 at 2:34 pm Mezza(Quote)
@ Richard “If you want to go a crusade against Scientology and PMG, then say so and why….be open with the actual reasons”. Oz has been MORE than open with his reasons for this crusade – every post goes back over the ongoing issues and problems. Read over ALL of them Richard…if you dare!
October 23rd, 2009 at 2:48 pm James(Quote)
Seems like you have rattled them oz.
If Richard is genuine in saying that you are spreading misinformation, why doesn’t he correct it for us..?
October 23rd, 2009 at 3:06 pm Richard(Quote)
When one sheep runs they all run. The others don’t know why they just follow. People love drama and sensationalism. The press and media companies of the world use this all the time and so many just lap it up, again and again.
You need to pull the wool away from you eyes and see that taking snippets of information and building them into an ‘intriguing’ rumour to create hype not fact, is the point.
If you form your opinions from this basis you will at best, have half the information. Anyone can be anyone on the Internet, this level of disinformation is easy to propagate & easily absorbed. Its used to be “its true, I read it in a book”, now “Its true, I read it on the internet”. Think about it…..
October 23rd, 2009 at 5:41 pm Richard(Quote)
Nothing like punting your business, at the expense of anothers success.
October 23rd, 2009 at 5:50 pm Richard(Quote)
Nothing like an INFORMED opinion. Thanks Damon.
October 23rd, 2009 at 6:06 pm Martin(Quote)
Seems she forgot to inform you personally about un-retiring
So much for an informed opinion!!
Been overseas for the last month… yes it is possible to travel without subscribing to PMG.. Great work Oz (and all the regulars) on keeping people informed.
Isn’t freedom of speech a wonderful thing!
October 23rd, 2009 at 6:16 pm Martin(Quote)
Richard. Next time you’re prospecting on the phone, please remember your statement above.. it just might save another poor soul from going bankrupt.
October 23rd, 2009 at 6:43 pm Richard(Quote)
Happy to remember this whole conversation. When you’re misinforming them on the web, with hype and disjointed data its easy…..
October 23rd, 2009 at 6:43 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Richard Baldock
What exactly have I sensationalised or self promoted (besides posting the article on Twitter)? And I certainly don’t post everything and anything I get my hands on re. Polaris. This was just too co-incidental to ignore and meshed all too suspiciously.
So what did I leave out? Lavenia encouraged people to join her in a Scientology course at a Scientology school. This is not up for debate or refutable, the screenshot clearly shows this happening. Instead of attacking my ability to put 2 and 2 together, perhaps stop and ask yourself ‘why is this sequence of events happening in such a suspiciously co-incidental manner?’
It’s what I asked myself before I started writing the article and is the basis of it.
I don’t create these events or encourage them to happen. As someone who writes about Polaris when I see interesting developments occur I’m going to write about them.
What is the ‘other half’ of the story I’m missing?
It does when it’s a screenshot and clearly shows a link between Polaris and Scientology. One thing I make clear when I write here is the times I’m giving my opinion, additionally when I cite sources I reference them.
And what is the positive angle to be extracted from a Polaris EMC member encouraging people to join her in a Scientology course at a Scientology school?
Lavenia is not hiring out a random church hall to have a table tennis tournament. She’s actively encouraging people to join her in attending a Scientology course at a Scientology school, this is very specific and not open to interpretation.
This argument (which is not really an argument, but rather a detraction from the points raised via character assasination of myself) has been raised by Polaris associates from the begginning and I even wrote a standalone article address it: Why I write about Liberty League International.
Again, how is a screenshot of Shannon Lavinia promoting Scientology courses rumour?
October 23rd, 2009 at 6:49 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Damon
…Stevens retired to pursue continuing to sell personald development products? That lifepath blog link floating about clearly shows she hasn’t retired.
Do you actually know her or did you think that by watching a few Youtube videos of her you’re all of a sudden an intimiate part of her life. Either she thinks you’re a rubbish friend or you’re full of it.
October 23rd, 2009 at 7:48 pm Boris(Quote)
Wow Oz, you have really rattled the scamming cultists as can be seen by Richard’s pathetic bleating. Here’s Wendy Stevens’ court record for fraud http://www.tsc.state.tn.us/opinions/tcca/PDF/023/stevensw.pdf — it sure helps you rise to the top of these scams if you have previous experience of fleecing the poor innocents.
October 23rd, 2009 at 7:49 pm iwonder(Quote)
What…like Polaris Media *cough Scientology* Group?
Oz- Congratulations on rattling the cages of these people and getting them to feel the need to write on here.
You are making a huge difference
October 23rd, 2009 at 7:51 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
I’m led to believe that court document is for a different Wendy Stevens and not the MLM woman, although I don’t know her well enough (at all) to confirm this.
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:13 pm mike(Quote)
Hi Richard – gee you sound like your using classic scientology tech = “always attack, never defend”
Richards purpose is to derail the thread – he will never answer a question directly but will turn it around into another question
This is ofcourse only from my observations – I’m sure everyone here with a critical mind can come to their own conclusions — isn’t it great to be able to question things openly without a cult looking over your shoulder telling you how to think !
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:17 pm mike(Quote)
Oh , PS : don’t you just love those scientology.org ads appearing on the page
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:25 pm Tonia(Quote)
Thanks for all your comments, it’s a great help. I responded to a link I saw on an article for home business opportunity and eventually began to receive mails from someone. I was asked to talk about myself to see if I was qualified for the business. I was then sent a mail with a link that took me to the Polaris Media page showing movies. I am to be given a call after I have seen the movies. I wondered about all the secrecy, why was I not told outright what the business was about until I had supplied information about myself? It seems curious to me.
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:42 pm Richard(Quote)
Absolutely. Isn’t that Ironic…. They also appear to selectively avoid commenting on other Polaris type businesses. It does emphasise the whole point about lack of objectivity though.
October 23rd, 2009 at 8:43 pm Richard(Quote)
Is that how they do it. I’ll have to take your word for it. I have little knowledge of their MO.
October 23rd, 2009 at 10:45 pm motiv8dan(Quote)
keep it up oz, dont let the brainwashed throw you with their cut and paste responses. I thought they were all told to stay away from debating in public?
October 24th, 2009 at 12:58 am Martin(Quote)
Saying ‘Im right and you’re wrong’ is far from debating.
Richards contribution is just the usual pmg rubbish. We’ve heard the same tripe from his like time after time with no real input.
They keep looking for an angle for Oz’s interest and just cannot see that his angle is purely in the interests of informing people of his point of view. The fact that 99% of the readers agree with him seems to evade their powers of observation.
October 24th, 2009 at 3:43 am josep(Quote)
Well this is a hilarious thread. Are people getting to the point of judging people based on their religion? Come on people, look at yourselves? What year are we in? What century are we in?
1- Who cares what religion people practice, I don’t
2- If I invited people to a “productivity seminar” held in a christian seminary hall, would I be put out and hanged?
3- If I practice Islam, and ran a company that taught personal development principles, will I be subject to stoning.
My question is to you all, is why should I care about this?
Discussing the viability of a business venture based on religious belief is really ridiculous guys. I expect better of people.
October 24th, 2009 at 4:02 am josep(Quote)
Mr James Larson,
If Lifepath associates would focus on being lifepath associates, they would make alot more money. Your constant comparison marketing of LLI/Polaris only hinders your income potential.
Look none of the leaders of LLI/Polaris/LifePath have never reached the levels of real top income earners in the direct sales/network marketing industry. No one has developed a consistent 7 figure yearly income in these companies. While there are many consistent 1million, 2 million, 3 million, 4 million, 5 million dollar earners in network marketing, there are none from these companies yet. Why, because of the type of marketing / posts like the one you just posted on this blog.
Marketing Strategy: Catch people who have been through the polaris information process while they are doing research and use negativity to sell your biz opp to them. Profitable approach but not a real top income earner approach. You will be stuck in the 6 figure / yearly range having to rebuild it every month.
As for Stevens moving over to your company: Great, what ever is best for her and her family.
But what really bites me, is people who go make 1 million dollars or 2 million dollars in 5 years and then decide to coach other people. When I never see the real top income earners in the industry (1-5 million dollars per year, consistently) go out and start coaching for a living. Maybe they are just to busy making (1-5 millions dollars per year residual).
Why is that?
October 24th, 2009 at 6:56 am Lisa(Quote)
I “Lisa Mcpherson” Cross-Examined Scientology and Polaris/North Star On Google and Found this interesting article in wikipedia…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_opera_in_Scientology_scripture#Coltice
Hubbard said that the following alien civilizations existed or still exist:
[edit]
In 1968, Hubbard gave details on Xenu’s “R6 implants”, which took place on a planet called Coltice. Coltice, according to Hubbard, orbits the star Polaris. Hubbard did not specify whether this means the largest, Polaris A (commonly known as the “North Star”) or the two smaller Polaris stars, Ab and B, in its trinary system. Coltice is said by Hubbard to be a member of the Galactic Confederacy. As with other Galactic Confederacy planets, the people of Coltice’s civilization looked much like Earth circa 1950-1960. Hubbard also spoke of a group on Coltice called the “Loyal Officers”, who sought to protect the planet from Xenu even though it was they who had elected him to power in the first place.[17]
[edit]
After reading this it scared me and I realized that Kridder is deeper into scientology than I thought…
In addition I think that he uses Shannon Lavinia as his front person…
She seems all nice and happy, but she is like the evil underlord of all it with Kridder controlling her brain and speaking through her as they chum it up at their houses in LA as best friends…
Kridder is probably a good man just led astray on a hocus pocus religion after he was cured by scientology practices of detoxifying his body of all drugs he tried after his skiing accident…This made him feel good and better about things and then he entrusted the church of scientology to his life and now practices to become a Thetan OT…
Therefore he was sold on scientology and uses Polaris as his life’s work to push the messages of scientology out to the public with his other “loyal officers”/EMC members…The inner circle…T
The LA EMC are tight knit and controlling, the other EMCers are on the outside…
Beware of being pushed out if you don’t become a Scientologist…
EMC members reading this…What are you thinking really?
Are you that greedy that it just doesn’t matter how you make money?
If you are going to do something with your life that is deceptive do something cooler like rob banks…
Kridder and Lavinia’s/North Star Marketing have doomed themselves associating with a religion that is down right manipulative and scary…
Scientology will be the end of Kridder Lavinia and Polaris.
Because Polaris is a verified front for scientology based on the wording Kridder uses in his speeches, company name, ect… they will be ruined!
You cannot have a personal development company leading to a religion, it just doesn’t seem to work…
Another Rant…
And having a company promoting entrepreneurship, but forbidding you from operating in other online companies selling products…Come on
entrepreneurship does not have a ceiling…Ok so if your a polaris distributor, your basically a glorified employee pretending to be an entrepreneur if your being limited and governed by what you can and cannot sell…I think that your “individual sovereignty” has been taken away…hahahaha “keep it light Kridder”
You cannot forbade people from being entrepreneurs promoting only real estate as to where they should invest- outside of your leases, do you invest in real estate? Some people don’t like or have the credit/capital to invest in real estate…
Shannon’s post above OUTRIGHT proves she is moving people towards Scientology– how blatant is that?
Shannon should take advice from Scientologist and detoxify her body.
Wendy leaving Polaris has obviously brought this whole conversation about and who knows why she left…
She is supposed to be a lesbian and Scientology definitely prohibits the acts performed by lesbianisms…
She probably had better opportunities with people that would promote her whether she is a “thetan meat body” (look up thetan meat body) or not.
In fact Scienblologists do not like anyone outside of their cultish black hat alien conventions…Have you seen the CEO of Scientology…What a piece of work…
Think about it…
If you knew that the owner of your company worshiped the devil, would you work for that company?
Well you know that Krider worships Hubbard as Tom Cruise does in this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTKxtMGcvAY&feature=related, so why work for him and lead people on the scientology path..
Is that Krider & Shannon in the audience?
Here’s an Idea…Get Krider in action going to church of scientology in LA…Take pictures/videos and see for yourself…
At the end of the day in Polaris “the trinary star system” where the media group “loyal officers” came from, defenders of x-e-n-u are going to try to get you to understand and practice Advanced Technology that only they know about…
The advancement levels all lead to dirty money & a friendship with the Underground Underlord “Shannon,” who will disown you as soon as you cross her sweet little I mean “big” path and Scientologist activist Shane Kridder,
SO the question becomes, what is Shannon and Shane going to say about these “rumors,”
*they are just rumors,
*wikipedia is not the authority,
*we are simple entrepreneurs helping innocent men and women make I mean loose money as individual sovergn entrepreneurs I mean “glorified employees”…
*Or will they say nothing and act like they are not reading this…
If will be fun to see how they spin this one…they will probably threaten the owner of this site and take it down…
Well the bottom line is they are master manipulators and will confuse you into you not knowing what you just read…
They will call it lies, not comment, and realize that their new company will get labeled as a scientology front forever…And they will never be able to escape that…Ever…
Copy this article cause it may get taken down
October 24th, 2009 at 11:48 am Ann O'Nymous(Quote)
Never heard of any of the structures mentioned here, except scientology, but they seem to be pyramid schemes.
Zhe outcome is always the same. The happy few who started them – and a few others that are good at it – make a lot of money out of the newcomers and show it to them as a proof of success. As it is unstainable, people rapidly jump out and start their own scheme.
Feel free to loose your money that way. There are always people ready to take it.
Scientology follows a slightly different model, but it also will help you spend your money in exchange of nothing valuable.
October 25th, 2009 at 1:58 pm iwonder(Quote)
Josep, sorry to be blunt, but you are delusional.
When you ask “Why should I care about this?” …do you stop to think of the many people scammed by Polaris (now publicly linked to Scientology) that ALREADY HAVE THEIR OWN RELIGION?
I think Catholics and Christian members of Polaris – to name a couple of religions- would have a great deal of trouble with the FACT that Polaris in linked to Scientology. One of the main teachings is that God is a MYTH…that only those not enightened believe in God…
Wake up Josep… or, are you one of the EMC ripping people off and scared of losing your disgusting way of an income?
Oz- Congratulations. I have told quite a few people about this site and they are now leaving Polaris.
October 25th, 2009 at 2:47 pm josep(Quote)
Nope, not part of EMC.
iwonder- Would Catholics and Christians have a problem with a company linked to Islam? Would Muslims have a problem with a company linked to Christianity? Would atheists have a problem with a company that was linked to beliefs in a God? Etc…
I think you are delving into a territory that you are ill equipped to handle.
and
to delve into your level of understanding—-> iwonder, you’re an idiot.
October 25th, 2009 at 2:52 pm Dave Allan(Quote)
All of this debate is interesting but the there is a very simple solution to this issue. If I owned a direct sales company that was being linked to Scientology (but in reality wasn’t involved at all) I would come out with a statement unequivocally denying any involvement and state the truth so as to set the record straight. It’s time for Krider to come forth and do this. If he doesn’t, well…that says something too.
October 25th, 2009 at 9:03 pm iwonder(Quote)
Hit a nerve Josep?
Tell you what, go meditate, do your Beyond Freedom, and try not to let Tony Rush find out you were on here…naughty naughty!
(Oh, and in case it isn’t clear for you- The FACT remains that Scientology in Polaris means that the focus is on RECRUITING NEW MEMBERS… not assisting them with personal development/financial gain. Methinks many of the remaining members who have not left yet will not be too happy about that….and I for one intend to show as many people as I can what crooks you are
)
Interesting idea…
An extremely interesting and disturbing read…
http://derrenbrown.co.uk/blog/2009/10/church-scientology-defied-coroner-suicide/
October 26th, 2009 at 12:27 am Steve(Quote)
josep:
You suggest judging people based on their religion is a bad thing? If you think this, then I believe you’re the idiot.
Religion seems to have earned this special protection from the usual rules of analysis and criticism.
If you don’t think that there are religions out there that are batshit insane, then you haven’t looked very far. To judge a person because they subscribe to one of these religions is absolutely what you should do.
The viability of PMG is highly questionable without the link to Scientology. That link just adds an extra layer of suspicion and sets off some more red flags.
And people of different faiths or those without faith could very well have an issue with companies that don’t share the same world view. I have a lot of respect for any organisation that does good. For me personally, I will almost always favour a secular charity, because, for example, when I donate money to help feed starving people in Africa, what these people need is food and education. Bibles and misinformation to push religious agendas isn’t what they need.
This is my opinion and feelings based on objective reasoning, and it’s naive to think that religion doesn’t play a part in these things, and when the religion is a cult, and let’s not kid ourselves, Scientology is a cult and is recognised as such in some countries, being aware and having the information at hand is absolutely essential.
Transparency is the key, and that only comes from openness, information and rational discourse.
October 26th, 2009 at 2:16 pm josep(Quote)
You guys are hilarious.
October 26th, 2009 at 2:25 pm iwonder(Quote)
Awww thanks Josep
(Must have done his Beyond Freedom today)
October 26th, 2009 at 2:58 pm Vince(Quote)
It’s not ridiculous at all, and whether you care or not is up to you. If my opinion is people who believe in what Scientology preaches are fruit loops, I’m perfectly entitled to think that. And you’re entitled to agree or disagree with an opinion. You’re also entitled to not visit this site if it’s something you don’t care about…but you do care, hence your replies.
Calling people idiots because they don’t agree with what you believe? And he’s an idiot? Yeah, right.
October 26th, 2009 at 3:08 pm Vince(Quote)
What century? Scientology is less than 60 years old.
October 26th, 2009 at 3:38 pm iwonder(Quote)
Good news guys- I have posted a link to here on a networking profile of mine, and another person has left Polaris after learning of their links with Scientology and motives.
October 26th, 2009 at 4:04 pm Roly(Quote)
@Richard Baldock
Er… um… what did *G*F*C* stand for again? Global what?
Pardon me, but I thought we are currently witnessing the biggest, in dollar terms, FAILURE of the free-market economy to be self-regulating, requiring the biggest bailout by taxpayer dollars into private companies, some mind-bogglingly rich and influential, Socialised to stop Wall St imploding – Lee-mans, Bare Stern, Fanny Mac. Then there’s Mad-hoff with the mon-ey.
Seems to me your comment is internally *contradictory*; in a free market what *sells* is *good*, sensationalism *sells*, ipso sensationalism is good pure free market capitalism in action. So what’s your problem? You want *morality* to go with the fries? Some sort of regulation of direction (like they have in China?). You a SOCIALIST or something?
@josep
Is Scientology actually a *religion* (in any meaningful sense of the word), or is it just another scamming space (case) cult dressed up to look like one?
October 26th, 2009 at 4:37 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Josep,
I have no problem with people being Scientologists but when they write personal development programmes and sell them to the public who are unaware of their beliefs it is scary.
I know of four people out of Polaris within the last fortnight.
Keep it going Oz. Wish I had found you before i lost $20 000.
October 26th, 2009 at 7:48 pm V(Quote)
The ads on your page are scientology atm.
Co-incidence?
October 26th, 2009 at 8:22 pm mike(Quote)
google ads – scientology organisation gets ads linked to any page that mentions them.
October 27th, 2009 at 1:29 am RT(Quote)
IF Shane Krider, Gene Braxton, John Lavenia and Shannon Lavenia are active Scientologists, that is their personal choice and I don’t believe anyone should begrudge them of that.
However, Liberty League/Polaris Media Group produces and promotes PERSONAL DEVELOPMENT PRODUCTS. Ask anyone who has actively participated in their “training and support” and they will tell you that 90% of the “training and support” has to do with mindset and personal development, not practical business building tactics or strategies. This is why so many people leave frustrated – because marketing is a difficult and potentially expensive skill set to learn and there is very little concrete training provided. In fact, the value of learning true business building skill sets is virtually ignored behind an attitude of “get your mind right and your business will fall in to place”.
In other words, the very nature of their business model CREATES the need for their personal development products because failure is placed on the individual, not on a flawed business model.
I think the real issue here is that there is NO WAY for a personal development company run by active Scientologists with a product line developed by active Scientologists (a religion accused by many of mind-control, abuse and secretive recruiting practices) to distinguish between their “religion”, their “business” or their “products”. They will be, by the very nature of the beast, one and the same.
So the crux of the deception, I believe, is that the partnership with The Church of Scientology isn’t fully disclosed. If people want to join an MLM selling personal development products based on Scientology teachings, they are free to do so and we should let them be.
BUT, if people join an MLM selling personal development products only to later discover, after they’ve invested thousands and thousands of dollars, that they’ve unknowingly not only been personally receiving Scientology teachings (either through the products, the company-sponsored “training and support”, or at the live events) but also selling personal development products based on Scientology, well that sounds like deception and fraud to me.
Of course we all know why this partnership has not been publicly revealed or disclosed by Polaris Media Group – because it would kill the marketing and recruiting for the Polaris Media Group business opportunity. Ask any former associate and they will tell you Liberty League/PMG was a tough sell (except for a few talented individuals with exceptional telephone sales skills) without the Internet abuzz about a controversial connection to a suspect religious organization.
With that said, I believe we should let Polaris Media Group off the hook with this one caveat: many Polaris Media Group marketers advertise the business’s connection to the teachings of the book and movie sensation “The Secret” on their marketing pages. Given that the precedent has already been established, I don’t think it’s asking too much for all PMG marketers to be required to disclose, in both their online and offline marketing campaigns, the following:
“THIS BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY’S PRODUCTS, TRAINING AND SUPPORT ARE BASED ON AND ENDORSED BY THE CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY”.
At least then people would know what they’re getting in to BEFORE they respond to an advertisement.
Full Disclosure: THAT’S what integrity looks like.
P.S. – Ironically, ABC News here in the states is currently running a series on alleged Scientology abuses. Anybody unclear as to why this connection is important to understand should take a few minutes and look at this investigative reporting.
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/scientology/
P.S.S. – As far as the ads on Oz’s website go: The Church of Scientology is running either a CONTENT campaign on Google Adwords or a SITE TARGETED campaign on Google Adwords. The first type of campaign will place their ad on sites containing relevant keywords (in this case it’s most likely the keyword “Scientology”) and the second type of campaign will place their ad on sites they specifically choose, such as http://www.Ozsoapbox.com.
October 27th, 2009 at 8:06 am Lisa(Quote)
So Shane Krider believes he is a “Thetan Meat Body” and he is from the Polaris Trinary Star System.
Is he?
Does he want you to believe that?
What about the “Meaty Shannon?”
Does she believe that?
Is she a “Thetan Meat Body” or just a “Meaty Body?”
Can we even speculate on this or is it just too far fetched…
Should we laugh about this or try to help them?
I have a lot of questions and no answers…
October 27th, 2009 at 8:52 am John Galt(Quote)
No, it’s the same Wendy Stevens. She talks about this lightly in one of her videos. She’s a felon.
As far as PMG and Scientology, who knows. Polaris’s basic product is a DVD called “Know For Yourself” which is (I would think) about as much of an anti-cult message as can exist. But I still don’t see the point. Tahitian Noni is run by Mormons. Amway is run by fundamentalist Christians. Melaleuca is run by Mormons. And all of these companies are engaged in “teaching” and “training” their associates. Does that mean they’re recruiting people into their religions? I doubt it. Who cares what religion someone is in? As usual, Oz is just engaging in sensationalism.
John
October 27th, 2009 at 9:16 am Boris(Quote)
I beg to differ on this point. I have seen the damage that Scientology inflicts on the lives of people who have become involved, even at the periphery. Scientology and scams like LLI/PMG both leave enormous collateral damage in their wakes. I hate to think what a combination of the two would do.
October 27th, 2009 at 9:53 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Really? A dvd that encourages people to dismiss all information not put out by Polaris isn’t cult like? Anti-cult would be telling people to go read whatever they want and draw their own conclusions based on a number of factors such as credibility and reliability of the information source(s).
Scientology’s history provides more then enough sensationalism, all I had to do was take a screenshot.
October 27th, 2009 at 10:54 am josep(Quote)
Anti-cult would be telling people to go read whatever they want and draw their own conclusions based on a number of factors such as credibility and reliability of the information source(s).
Oz,
That is exactly what is proposed on the dvd.
Just an FYI, from someone who has seen it.
The Know For Yourself DVD is more of a “Cult Busting” dvd.
October 27th, 2009 at 11:16 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Here’s the sales pitch for Know For Yourself:
It’s pretty clear the tone the dvd is going to take.
Tony Rush actively tells associates on his Polaris Ning forum to not give any attention to ‘negativity’ on the internet, and who knows what else is advised non-publicly. Krider even had some words about ‘those blogs on the internet’ at the Supercharged Saturday event back a few weeks back if I remember correctly.
For a further example of company censorship just look at the comment left by CCPRO Corporate this morning after one of their associates (not sure what CC call their ‘entrepeneurs’) started discussing their company.
With all the press releases, social networking, youtube video spamming and whatever else Polaris get up to one this is clear – they don’t want people reading information about the company released by anyone but themselves.
October 27th, 2009 at 1:27 pm Roly(Quote)
@RT
Excellent post RT.
To which I would add a reverse-angle view; that anybody *with* those skills would have much the same reaction many have had on first sight – huh? wah? wot? Six-figure income with no work, no selling, no outlay, instantly profitable (but it’s a secret). Bank robbery? Credit card fraud? If you have any practical experience around a real business this has to look and smell like a scam and a cult from the get-go.
In my experience it has been important to build long-term ongoing relationships with clients, even obvious one-offs. With these Personal Development products it seems to me that the ongoing potential with each client is seriously limited, requiring a constant flow of new clients to replace the missing constant flow from existing clients.
“Passing-up” only hides the reality of the need for an exponentially expanding (or at least constantly churning) bottom layer.
@josep
Quite so; and it is a matter of record that the managers of LLI/PMG are telling their associates NOT to read ANY critical material, to make no personal evaluation.
When it comes to doing due research, intending associates will encounter “impartial” reviews of LLI c/f Lifepath (&c) that are actually shills put up by parties with vested interests. This is clearly a deceptive and unethical practice.
An ethical business doesn’t have to defend its operations with a snowstorm of bullshit, as has happened here. I’ve been there more than once, and I’ve walked away a winner by being open, truthful, and playing with a totally straight bat; checkable facts, documents, honest answers.
MLM, LLI, PMG, Scientology, and all the rest of the alphabet soup are just a bunch of New Age business-cultists playing with real money – yer good ol’ Three Card Trick.
October 27th, 2009 at 3:58 pm Joy(Quote)
The thing I really don’t understand is why everyone is so vitriolic on these boards. I joined LLI, invested up to the hilt, lost all my money and never succeeded because I couldn’t bring myself to market something that had so financially ruined my family.
But why is everyone so stinking angry here? What’s the point of slinging hateful statements? If anything you guys could help all of us poor saps, who joined simply to help our own families, by starting a class action law suit. At least then you’d be doing something productive rather than saying Tony rush might find out where you were. What is that? How old are you? Do you really communicate like that in real life?
What if there’s a slim chance that it’s not true, are you going to apologize to this Richard guy for his determination in trying to get his money out of HIS business? What good are you doing by bitching him out?
Why not lend a hand! We’ve already been smacked down. Sheesh!
October 27th, 2009 at 8:53 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Joy,
Don’t you think these boards help to warn others of the danger of Polaris Media Group. I wish it was up and running when i was first sucked in.
We are also making fun of ourselves and how we were all sucked into this cult-like business.
I do think it is a good idea about starting a class action law suit.
I have been directed by the OFT to take my advisor and PMG to a tribunal.
Has anyone else been successful in doing this?
October 28th, 2009 at 1:09 am Roly(Quote)
{I’ll just leave this here}
PARIS (Reuters) – A Paris court on Tuesday fined the French branch of the Church of Scientology a total of 600,000 euros ($902,200) after finding it guilty of fraud but allowed the group to continue operating in France.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091027/ts_nm/us_france_scientology_ruling
October 28th, 2009 at 5:40 am john(Quote)
I would hope some one from polaris would clear this up. they talk about pouring positive media all over the net. wonder how this one slipped past them.
October 28th, 2009 at 7:59 am Lisa(Quote)
Why would you even say that John Galt–>
This is a goober statement and confirms the fact that over in PMG
“The Blind Are Still Leading The Blind”
Those companies you mentioned are not personal development companies…
They are selling consumable items…
You are border line sounding like a corporate EMC meat body…
YOU DORK!
Shifting the offensive attack onto other companies like all underground sleuth Scientology manipulators are taught, when your representing a company that is clearly Scientology driven and teaching those principles through their products…
The companies products you mentioned are not education on how to live your life…
PMG claims they are a life coaching company, but the only way you can become a certified life coach/EMC or whatever is to attend the Hubbard School of Scientology…
ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME! WAKE UP…You are either duped yourself or duping others…Either way their is no excuse for your stupidity…
I don’t know about anyone else here, but I would not want to be life coached by a scientologist…
Ok so forget about scientology for a minute…Is PMG a viable company?
UHMMMM>>>>>
Well you can’t forget about that MAJOR FACT because it is a personal development/life coaching company run by and teaching values, practices, and beliefs of Scientology…
It would be different if they were selling tangible products like the companies you mentioned…
Or if they just came out and said “hey we are a scientology based company…”
John Galt, what I got from you in that statement is number #1 you are clueless, #2 you are probably an PMGer yourself, #3 You are probably even on EMC, #4 You are a professional manipulator, #5 You are a sensationalist yourself, #6 you really don’t think before you speak…
Sensationalism…Sensationalism is pretending to be a personal development company when you are a scientology company…
October 28th, 2009 at 11:43 am josep(Quote)
Interesting, everyone here is talking about the Scientology link to this company, but no one knows anything about Scientology. Do your research….
Simple google search would pull up the following:
These actions are outlawed in Scientology-
Practicing Scientology outside of the Scientology Umbrella Organization
“145) Organizing splinter groups to diverge from Scientology practices still calling it Scientology or calling it something else.
“146) Organizing a splinter group to use Scientology data or any part of it to distract people from standard Scientology.”
October 28th, 2009 at 11:59 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Yeah so is running a pyramid scheme in Australia yet this didn’t stop Liberty League from running here for 2 years. Credibility or religious ethics isn’t something I associate with either Scientology or LLI/Polaris.
October 28th, 2009 at 12:34 pm josep(Quote)
The point is that the link is very weak. As for it being a pyramid, that will never be proven or taken to court. The evidence is just not there. If it was, easy enough to bar PMG from doing business in Australia. In the US it would take 2 weeks. Australia, would be faster.
October 28th, 2009 at 2:22 pm Boris(Quote)
LLI/PMG and Scientology are just two sides of the same coin. Both aim to separate people from their hard earned money and both are run by unscrupulous and cynical scam artists who prey on those who are often at their most vulnerable. Maybe they are both in the strictest sense legal, but they are certainly both immoral, unethical and possibly evil.
October 29th, 2009 at 12:56 am RT(Quote)
Josep a “simple” Google search will ALSO reveal that Scientology uses numerous “Front” organizations for recruiting purposes such as Narcanon, Applied Scholastics, Citizens Commission on Human Rights, Concerned Businessmens Association of America, Prosperity Magazine, and WISE. Each and every one of these organizations lure people in with the promise of “fixing” their problems only to be introduced to Scientology as the answer. Not too big of a leap for them to address the “problem” of money with PMG (i.e. Scientology) as the “solution”. VERY effective recruiting method for Scientology.
My problem, again, is not with those individuals who choose to practice Scientology as that is a matter of personal choice. My problem is that the connection is not disclosed.
October 29th, 2009 at 1:38 am josep(Quote)
Usually in these conspiracy theories there is a money trail to be revealed. Why would PMG be a front organization for Scientology? No money in it, and pmg will never supply enough recruits to make it remotely fruitful for Scientology. Scientology 10 million members and pmg 3 thousand .And from research I have done the 2 business models do not lend to each other, they run parallel to each other so PMG would a be a useless feeder program. What is the pay off?
Again, if you are going to have a good conspiracy theory you must define the money trail. No money trail, no conspiracy. This is fundamental in establishing a link.
October 29th, 2009 at 4:40 am Lisa(Quote)
Joseph you are obviously a scientologist or pmg legal counsel or emc and that is not a simple google search…
The fact remains that the emc are trained as
scientologist and pmg is teaching Scientology
through so called personal development and then
getting phone calls by Scientology recruiter like you
to join the cultish religion…
You are just another master manipulator and
wise ass…
Stop duping people and helping the cover up…
The fact remains people don’t want to be involved or
associated with that religion period and at this point
there is nothing you can do about it.
October 29th, 2009 at 6:19 am RT(Quote)
Let’s see, the “money trail” would be this:
(1) John Doe spends $25,000 to join PMG, which he believes is a stand-alone, legitimate business opportunity.
(2) John Doe uses the personal development products, attends the training and live events but still can’t generate a profit, as is the case with well over 95% of PMG associates (rumor has it that LLI’s income disclosure calculation only included those individuals who actually sold two Beyond Freedom packages, which would exclude a vast majority of their historical associate base from this calculation).
(3) John Doe is reluctant to throw in the towel so he seeks advice from a “leader” either through personally or through recommendations made on the “leader’s” Facebook profile, book,website or live training calls.
(4)The “leader” then recommends a Scientology front program as the “solution”, the “fix”, the “additional training” that will make all the difference.
(5)John Doe is now on Scientology’s radar and if he bites, he’s now on the fast track for a curriculum that will cost him upwards of $600,000.
(6) Oh, and that referring PMG leader who JUST SO HAPPENS TO BE A SCIENTOLOGIST? They personally get a little piece of that $600,000 action for referring John Doe to Scientology.
THERE’S your money trail Josep. $25,000 to $600,000 in six easy steps.
October 29th, 2009 at 8:47 am iwonder(Quote)
Josep- why do you care so much?
October 29th, 2009 at 9:03 am Boris(Quote)
There is now no doubt that Josep is a scientologist. Only one of them could claim a membership of 10 million for their scumbag religion. The real numbers are a little lower (55,000 in USA and maybe another 50,000 in the rest of the world) as you can see at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology#Membership_statistics This completely negates his whole point about there being no payoff for collusion between the two scams.
October 29th, 2009 at 9:20 am Lisa(Quote)
He is either head Scientology recruiter or meaty Shannon told him to come defend Polaris and the loyal officers…
I am guessing he is the guy that calls all the recruits referred to him by pmg or a fact finding thetan trying to publicy defend the freaky alien fire walkers…
Go defend Lisa Molina and her public image which has been ruined
every since her auditing brought out the fact she allegedly
slept with the primary and former leader(s)of pmg and caused a
certain couple a divorce…
She is who needs public defending… guess you gotta hand it to
Scientology for that one exposing one of the “all smiles” sleuths…
I gotta give it to Shannon for not sleeping around
but then again no one probably wanted to.
So how many people did Lisa Molina sleep with?
October 29th, 2009 at 12:08 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Just thought you all might be interested that Rania from Six figure chicks has also left PMG. Also a couple who were on EMC have gone. People leaving in droves. Yippee.
October 29th, 2009 at 12:08 pm josep(Quote)
RT- No payoff, no money trail. 99.99% of people coming into a bizop like pmg does not have or has has access to 600k. The fact remains there is a zero chance that pmg serves as a supposed feeder program.
Lisa- Nope not a EMC. Not a Scientology. Not a meat body. Not legal counsel for anyone. Not a lawyer. Don’t know Shannon, don’t know Lisa. I am not a NAZI either.
Not defending anything just laying out my opinion just as you are laying out yours.
Iwonder- I care about the conversation. The debate. The 2 sides of a story. Be kind of boring just to have meat bodies and distributor drones engaging in these debates Wouldn’t it?
October 29th, 2009 at 1:35 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
With EMC members actively promoting Scientology books and courses, how on earth can you say there’s zero chance of Polaris being a feeder program with any credibility?
October 29th, 2009 at 1:40 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
The following info was provided via email:
With 60% of the Malaysian population following Islam, I don’t think they’re going to feel very good about it at all.
October 29th, 2009 at 2:48 pm Roly(Quote)
@josep
Speak for yourself.
I’ve been close enough to aquire the circuit of the wonderful E-meter such as was sold to the French woman for 20,000 Euros, a very unremarkable Galvanic Skin Resistance meter built out of parts costing around $20.
But you tell us all about it (I’m in the mood for a good belly laugh).
@josep
More bunk. There is such a thing as a conspiracy of *interest*. These New Age modalities may or may not have a money element, but they always have a personal power element. Money is not the only motivation.
Connected or not, LLI and Scientology are birds of a feather.
October 29th, 2009 at 3:11 pm Martin(Quote)
So Josep, after saying a while back that you could see $5 million dollars a year coming from PMG, now you declare there’s no money in it. Make up your mind man.
By the way.. Rania from the infamous SixFigureChicks has just posted on Whirlpool her resignation confirmation.
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1206044&r=21341830#r21341830
October 29th, 2009 at 4:46 pm david(Quote)
I have also heard that they hope to move into China!!!
I can just see them hammering their little bandit signs into telegraph poles….they would be shot at dawn!
October 29th, 2009 at 4:59 pm Martin(Quote)
Their next conference is supposedly happening in China. With the link to Scientology and their track record with Liberty League, it will be very interesting to see how the Chinese authorities deal with it.
Shot at dawn…….. sounds like a plan!!
October 29th, 2009 at
[...] Lavenia (who recently invited people to join her in doing a Scientology course), lists herself as a co-owner of Unified Wealth Solutions on her [...]
October 30th, 2009 at 1:35 am josep(Quote)
martin,
no money to be made from moving people from pmg to Scientology. Read carefully.
Roly,
The only reason for a conspiracy is money. Money is power. If one does not see it, look deeper, if the money is not there, there is no conspiracy. A conspiracy of interest just means the money trail is well hidden but it is there.
October 30th, 2009 at 9:02 am iwonder(Quote)
What is boring is your repetition of the same inane tripe.
I tought you were told to ignore this site.
October 30th, 2009 at 10:45 am RT(Quote)
Josep, really? No money to be made?
According to Wikipedia’s source “Auditing as a Career” (a Church of Scientology publication) “The Church pays members 10% commissions, called FSM (Field Staff Member) commissions, on new recruits they bring in who take a course or get counseling.”
According to the price schedule posted on http://www.xenu.net/archive/prices.html the current (conservative) total cost for the whole bridge to OT9 readiness is estimated at $365,000 – $380,000.
10% of $380,000 = $38,000
It looks to me there’s at least $38,000 to be made on every PMG associate who also joins Scientology per the “advice” and “leadership” of the top income earners at PMG.
“But most people don’t have that kind of money” you say. According to just one testimonial on the http://www.xenu-directory.net/practices/hardsell.html site:
Andrea Catt: People were persuaded to re-mortgage their homes, sell their homes, cash in the policies supposed to pay off their mortgages, borrow against pensions, sell family jewels, borrow from their families, sell their cars. Anything you can possibly imagine that a person could do to raise money, people were persuaded to do to pay into Scientology. [...]
Looks to me like it’s not only possible, but very likely.
October 30th, 2009 at 12:31 pm josep(Quote)
Iwonder- If I seem repetitive it is because I respond to your repetitive diatribe. At least I give you a purpose and reason to post.
RT- Realistically your scenario is highly unlikely and the numbers of people able and willing to follow such a track are very small. The numbers just don’t make sense. But you are free to think as you wish.
October 30th, 2009 at 1:25 pm James(Quote)
If I didn’t bother to read previous comments I would’ve thought that you were talking about the reality of Polaris, funny how you can say that about Scientology, but can’t realise how the same applies to Polaris.
October 30th, 2009 at 1:34 pm Martin(Quote)
You could so easily delete ‘Scientology’ from the last sentence above and replace with ‘Polaris Media Group’.
Read carefully Josep … it will eventually click!
October 30th, 2009 at 2:27 pm josep(Quote)
Martin and James,
30k and 380k are vastly different in scope. Second people buy into franchises 300k – 1million dollars everyday and the majority of them fail and many remortgage their homes, sell their pensions etc… and end up bankrupt.
That is the way of the entrepreneur. 70 percent of millionaire entrepreneurs have been bankrupt at least once.
Read carefully guys maybe you will get it.
October 30th, 2009 at 3:55 pm iwonder(Quote)
Are you really that naive to suggest that an organisation linked to Scientology, and labelled a Pyramid Scheme can be compared to legitimate business?
I am curious to know how much YOU have made and shelled out for this scam, and in seeing proof.
hmm, no not really.
See the REASON for posting at the top of this thread.
Then go do your Beyond Freedom.
October 30th, 2009 at 3:57 pm iwonder(Quote)
Hey guys, Tony Rush is banging on about the new “NorthStar Marketing System” now….asking people what they think of it.
One comment was that she would let him know when she was able to actually get in with her login.
Ha- “marketing system” what a crock.
October 30th, 2009 at 5:05 pm Edward(Quote)
Hey iwonder,its a pity you weren’t this focussed when you were an associate.Maybe you would have been a success!!What type of an individual spends all of their time digging around social networks and websites of an organisation that they despise. Move on in your life.
October 30th, 2009 at 5:08 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Problem is Josep that many of these people are not entrepreneurs, but everyday people who take many years to pay back this type of money. I know of a single mum who lives in a caravan who took out a personal loan to pay for her conference tickets. She was praised for doing this.
Who is responsible? How would you feel if you signed this person up?
She is now back on the pension.
Got my papers from Department of Fair Trading today. Going to tribunal.
October 30th, 2009 at 5:10 pm Martin(Quote)
Something rehashed/plagerised that he is flogging off to the unsuspecting no doubt!! Anything to make an extra dollar from his victims. What a knob!
Where’d you pull these figures from? Would sure make interesting reading.
Aha! I’ve got it now:
PMG is a not a Franchise company.
PMG independant distributers are not entrepreneurs.
You’re a very confused person Josep. Too much time on the training/brainwashing calls me thinks.
October 30th, 2009 at 5:10 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Edward, Not about being successful in the business but having a conscience. Ripping people off.
October 30th, 2009 at 7:23 pm Mezza(Quote)
@Edward “What type of an individual spends all of their time digging around social networks and websites of an organisation that they despise. Move on in your life” And exactly why are you at this website???
October 30th, 2009 at 8:07 pm Edward(Quote)
Simple,I like the articles,OZ’s writing style and views on different issues,reading and sharing others opinions etc… I prefer this to mainstream media coverage of events,it just feels more real to me..and I enjoy it..sorry if that offends you..
October 30th, 2009 at 8:29 pm Mezza(Quote)
No offence taken..just curious. iwonder, like may other people on this thread, have been burnt badly, and use available means to follow what those responsible have been doing with their funds…In some ways a healthy response to “Move on with your life” is justice.
October 30th, 2009 at 8:35 pm Mezza(Quote)
In some ways, if people like Oz did stop “digging around social networks and websites of an organisation that they despise” this would not have come out and Polaris not facing the scrutiny it is…
October 30th, 2009 at 8:52 pm Edward(Quote)
I understand what you’re saying Mezza.
October 30th, 2009 at 9:44 pm Mezza(Quote)
Peace!
October 30th, 2009 at 10:07 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Awww everybody group hug!
October 31st, 2009 at 2:49 am Roly(Quote)
{you all done with your warm fuzzies now?}
Welcome @/B/oris.
Hi @Joy,
In one of the early LLI threads I made some critical comments, but I also made a clear call for everybody who feels done down by this deal to get together, or at the very least *co-ordinate*. I was generally howled down for trying to start a Movement or something. I was actually thinking more along the lines of justice and recompense.
It should still be there, but I’ll try and find and repost here.
{or maybe Oz can simply link to it? This is the hyper-inter webby thingy after all.}
@josep
Sorry, that won’t fly. Basic one-to-many logic flaw, not to mention…
October 31st, 2009 at 3:38 am josep(Quote)
Martin,
A little insight into franchises.
http://www.moyak.com/papers/franchising-failures.html
October 31st, 2009 at 2:08 pm Martin(Quote)
Basing your research on 1995 figures says a whole lot about what you write Josep…. I’ll leave it at that!
October 31st, 2009 at 3:46 pm Roly(Quote)
“To a man with a hammer, everything looks like a nail.”
Japanese proverb.
October 31st, 2009 at 4:36 pm HC(Quote)
November 1st, 2009 at 3:12 am josep(Quote)
Martin,
Nothing has change in the world of franchising since 1995.
and my opinions and research are based on my success in both franchising and network marketing. Don’t take my word for it, find out for yourself. The franchising industry is what it is…just like network marketing, the number of people who “fail” greatly outweighs the ones that do succeed. Like all entrepreneurial pursuits.
November 1st, 2009 at 8:15 am iwonder(Quote)
Oh, and I have. Thankyou for your amazingly insightful and wise advice. Ha!
But funny thing is, I can multitask….and do my utmost to expose you as fraudsters
Question: What do YOU have planned for when Polaris goes bellyup?
November 1st, 2009 at 4:37 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/society-and-culture/mad-scientologists-caught-in-a-web-of-their-own-making-20091031-hqqu.html?comments=28#comments
More scientologists scamming!
November 1st, 2009 at 6:11 pm Vince(Quote)
Was Scammed- Something that just stood out in that artice:
Sounds exactly like the old Liberty League/PMG…they had no problem telling people to ignore unsupportive friends and family.
November 2nd, 2009 at 4:54 am Andrew(Quote)
Great research. I have found LLI is a very “spiritual” group but didn’t understand the connection to Polaris. It seems Brent Payne kept things grounded. Does anyone know whats happened to brent payne?
I found this article about Polaris compensation plan and the link to LLI http://www.lucrativeturnkeybusiness.com/Polaris-Media-Group.html
November 2nd, 2009 at 9:14 am HC(Quote)
A class action suit seems to be in order. i am looking into it because when I joined LLI, I was supposed to be in a “money making position for life” with the initial investment covering that. Now with Polaris, I would have to invest more in that. “Sour grapes”… yes a bit, but the techniques are deceptive. Foolishly I fell for it all…my responsibility and my mistake, but the company bears responsibility for what it promotes, then abruptly changes; And must be responsible for full disclosure. Buyer beware. I did not pay enough heed to those warning me about all of “this type of thing”. But all of these that include downline, upline, passups, MLM models are all about the money. We all want to earn good money, but possibly it can be done with less deception and more product consciousness. Maybe in another universe…good lesson and hopefully well learned.
November 3rd, 2009 at 10:53 am LL and now Polaris winner(Quote)
95% of people fail at most things and ALWAYS blame someone else. Take a look around. 5% of the people hold 95% of the wealth because they are accountable.
they are on purpose.
they do not blame something or someone or the system …..bla bla bla….it wasn’t my fault….poor me…boo hoo… WAKE UP to yourselves and stop making up silly childish stories.
Polaris is what it is. A great positive educational company with the perfect business plan.
these soapbox thingies are chinese whispers on the net….. I feel so sorry for the people who actually believe most of the absolute garbage that is written by fools.
Fools believe what fools write.
What a great world this would be if we all just stopped complaining…be positive and attract positive results.
If you have lost your money GUESS WHAT! ITS YOUR FAULT! BE ACCOUNTABLE…You Only Lose if you QUIT….and it seems there are a lot of QUITTERS in the world…..95% of them.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:15 pm DC(Quote)
It would seem that they have killed the goose that laid the golden egg. Who will buy the package now that it is associated with a bunch of people that believe the Emperor Nazi Goring is going to beam in from the Planet Zorgon and fix all the problems. The scientologists will not buy it as they believe they are the elite of the earth with no problems. They might just as well become Moonies or Hari Krishna’s or at least extreme Muslims as that is a recognized religion not a cult.
November 3rd, 2009 at 12:46 pm Q(Quote)
More public linking of Polaris Media Group /Liberty League International to Scientology.
PMG/LLI Associate of the Month, Denmark Francisco doing videos in front of his extensive Scientology library.
PMG is not a front for Scientology. It is a company that is recruiting it’s members internally to join the Scientology religion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt78bbCxblk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le-g0Co08nU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voj2LuHAKC8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsLwmxLP6HQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0fqsHe7Fp0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVzTauP-jS4
November 3rd, 2009 at 1:15 pm iwonder(Quote)
Equally, I would say that if you have ripped people off and have to pay the money back to people in a class action lawsuit- I would say it is your fault.
I get why you are writing, I really do, I was in that same mindset.
I just hope you realise before you lose too much more money.
Best of luck to you.
November 3rd, 2009 at 3:02 pm HC(Quote)
LL you are so well programmed in the LLI/polaris rhetoric. So convinced of the model and products and their life changing capabilities. Been there, done that and got so bored and tired of the mindless repetitious droning. Sorry LL, know I made a dumb mistake and “owning” it. Right …the “opportunity” is meant for mindless drones that ga ga over each other and whine on about how successful they are for sucking people into the overpriced nonsense. The 95% who don’t continue are all so much less than you programmed “winners”. It would be torture for an independent thinker to be associated to long with this mindlessness disguised as enlightenment, no matter the “huge” income you may be ” attracting” Blah Blah Blah as you whine on and pat yourself on the back. We all deserve what we get.
November 3rd, 2009 at 8:27 pm Rod(Quote)
I guess you would class me as a fool for writing on here about losing $50k+ to LLI. I certainly feel foolish.
November 3rd, 2009 at 9:32 pm Martin(Quote)
If you ever get your head out of your ass long enough, you will see that in life, most people are successfull at what they do… it may not be what they ‘want’ to do, but invariably they are successfull at it.
Whatever happened to the 80/20 rule? Polaris are feeding you bull.
Now you’re just being a knob. The company has been in existance a wet week and you’re telling us how great it is??
Come back in six months when/if you’ve some proven
Mate. You’re stuck in La La land. Good luck with that.
November 4th, 2009 at 10:59 pm Greg(Quote)
Hi everyone. I am one of the lucky ones( but didn’t do enough home work before signing up) who got out early enough and lost only a hundred bucks or so. I initially got suspicious after receiving this email from my advisor the day after I purchased Beyond Freedom.
“Great hear from you then. I suggest you look at the information regarding the conference tickets – if at all possible – purchase both – this way you will be a the top end of the comp plan eligible to receive all bonuses without having to qualify monthly. Understand it may not be in the budget just see how you go.
Regards,
Lauren”
See how this scumbag is trying to suck as much money out of me funny enough only a few days before the changeover to PMG.
I was honest and explained that I couldn’t afford the tickets and wanted to get started selling beyond freedom asap so I could then afford them. I then didn’t hear from my advisor unless I made contact. After a week with beyond Freedom(I didn’t even bother to open It) I sent it back for a refund.
I am Thankful that I am one of the lucky ones. Does this scenario sound familiar I wonder??
November 4th, 2009 at 11:24 pm Greg(Quote)
I meant scumbag by the way and I nearly became one myself. So to all of you who have fallen back to reality I hope all of you have apologized to anyone you deceived and ripped off all for Scientology!!
November 5th, 2009 at 7:53 am iwonder(Quote)
I wans’t with this scam for very long…and of course (like most unknowing people) would have run a mile anyways if I knew the focus was on recruiting Scientology members and not on helping people to make money.
The number of people “signed up” with me was extremely minimal. I emailed information (including this website) to them and told them to run as fast as they could. This was BEFORE they purchased anything.
Yes, they are extremely good at not giving a crap unless you give them cash. My advisor ignored my calls asking for advice on advertising etc, but when I was thinking about purchasing a conference ticket (thankfully I didn’t), he was MORE than happy to talk to me. Day or night. Apologising profusely for not calling me back. I ended up not purchasing the ticket as I said, and never heard from him again- despite emailing him with a few questions about POlaris.
These people are RUTHLESS.
Advice to anyone thinking of giving it a go as it is their last resort- If you are in debt now, how will another 50k or so being in debt help?
I am already pushing a few buttons at Polaris….p*&sing a few ppl off by being open about my findings….I hope that others are doing the same.
November 5th, 2009 at 7:04 pm Greg(Quote)
iwonder
Keep up the good work/fight. By the way when I finished off my previous message with “I wonder” it wasn’t directed at you rather a figure of speach.
November 6th, 2009 at 9:48 am iwonder(Quote)
Ha- yes I know
All good.
And thankyou, I am keeping up with informing people about this scam. The EMC don’t like it, but meh- whadda ya do
I think the person to thank here is Oz though.
Without this blog, there would be alot more families ruined by this scam.
Oz- don’t ever forget that! And THANKYOU!!
November 6th, 2009 at 1:59 pm Martin(Quote)
Jeeez! I must be getting soft…. Twice now in the past few days, I find myself agreeing with you!
(Only messin’ with ya iwonder!)
People such as yourself deserve the credit too. It takes alot of guts to come on here and admit to making some poor descisions. Respect to you for that.
PolarisMediaGroup and their like depend a great deal on people being so embarrassed by ‘failing’ at their scam, that they prefer to walk away, losses included, and forget about the whole sorry experience.
I wouldn’t be expecting a Christmas card from the EMC if I were you!!
November 6th, 2009 at 3:43 pm iwonder(Quote)
aaaahahahaha you reckon?? With Polaris going under due to people now knowing about the Scientology link, I would be checking SEEK and not concentrating on Christmas cards if I were them…
Seriously though, the impact this blog has had is HUGE. The amount of people in my immediate circle as such that have left because of it is amazing.
The sheer amount of both money and mental anguish that has saved people….well Oz is to be commended.
November 6th, 2009 at 3:51 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Thanks for the continued support guys.
I’ve heard on good authority that apparently EMC members are being flown to LA for an “urgent crisis meeting” of some sort next week.
Can’t imagine what that’s about.
November 6th, 2009 at 3:54 pm iwonder(Quote)
Some are already there…. and Tony Rush is flying off to some meeting tomorrow as well..
November 6th, 2009 at 4:34 pm david(Quote)
I wonder if they charge each other for their internal meetings
November 7th, 2009 at 7:42 am mark(Quote)
The only real was to know why Wendy left PMG is to ask her. Has anyone done that? Supposing is just making a very uneducated guess is it not?
November 7th, 2009 at 7:51 am Columbo(Quote)
Oz Think this is great. Been reading with interest for a while, you have a great blog and some good contributors.
My point………got involved with LLI about 12 months ago. Really only wanted to see beyond Freedom as a product and if it could help me or not, then look at the wild income claims.
My background is corporate…highly successful with the UK’s biggest retailer (and the worlds 3rd largest as a hint)was a big six figure earner and I am relativly young. Wanted my own business and left to set it up (not LLI or Polaris). Business was failing when I got beyond freedom. Started using beyond freedom and my life changed (business and private!)Got rid of the business and was going to have a go at Polaris properly.
Went to Barcelona for the “Super Saturday” and had a fantastic time, was great fun and thought Krider and Levinia were actually really inspirational and took everything I had learned in corporate life to a tangible level.
The problem was…somthing just did not feel right. When you mixed with the EMC they were on their guard. They huddled together alot…
I did speak to people who like me used BF and got some value.
Last point… I don’t really see how it is so much different from any other business. People lose money..fact..people make money..fact. It is how it is explained that is the core issue, I will not be persuing a business op with Polaris anymore…but I will continue to apply Beyond freedom to my everyday life and instead of moaning about losing my money I will use it to my advantage.
Oh…Just one more thing……!
Oz…thanks for exposing the scientology link..if you need any inside info just email me..though I have probably compromised myself giving the same history I do on the BOC calls.
Good luck all
November 7th, 2009 at 10:27 am Cripes!!(Quote)
Well said Columbo – I totally agree with everything you said!! I to was part of LLI/Polaris, love the Beyond Freedom product and will continue to use it every day but as you say it wasn’t so much the original products that was the problem it’s the hidden agenda behind it all that is never exposed, the way it is explained etc…. I have left because where there are little lies or omissions there are sure to be huge ones behind all those!!
The curriculum as they call it was written by these people so to say that the curriculum going forward after Brent Payne left has no Scientology aspects to it would be ridiculous. I will not be purchasing any of the new products but as I said will continue to enjoy the classic Beyond Freedom!
The lies from EMC members and Shane himself are overwhelming and that is my issue, but it is all in hindsight, what can you do but move on and know that we now see it for what it is.
As much as I understand what you are doing here with this blog I think bigger action than this needs to be taken if they are to be stopped or at least made to disclose the entire system and business for what it really is and what they actually stand for.
November 7th, 2009 at 10:51 am Cripes!!(Quote)
Just out of interest, does anyone know if anyone has actively pursued reimbursement or compensation or a class action suit in Australia against them???
thanks guys!!
November 7th, 2009 at 1:33 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
I also agree with everything you have said Columbo. I too loved the Beyond Freedom but I am finding it hard to pick up due to being so disappointed in the whole business.
I am now about to begin a diploma in Life Coaching and make something positive out of my experience.
My biggest worry is that the new Beyond Freedom Evolution is being written by Scientologists, (as i have mentioned before).
I don’t think any religious group should be able to write Personal Development programmes without mentioning what their religious beliefs are.
November 7th, 2009 at 1:53 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
I agree and because we were sold all this under false premise that makes me wonder if there is anything we can do.
November 7th, 2009 at 7:37 pm iwonder(Quote)
She has gone to Lifepath, which I know on VERY good recommendation.
Anthing else?
November 7th, 2009 at 7:42 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Yeah she has and I don’t blame her, not that I have any intention of following, but its great to see the “leaders” of Polaris jumping ship to the competition. Just goes to show just how bad it must be at Polaris!!!
I also know that the EMC are all being flown to LA for a meeting, fat lot of good that is going to do them now!! Maybe they can all get together to talk about how much integrity they all have…… pfft!!
November 8th, 2009 at 7:00 am Lisa(Quote)
I heard Polaris is throwing in the towell and going out of business.
Their Scientology association has created a nightmare for them and something will never be able to escape!
Gotta hand it to Brent for seeing it coming!
I also heard that recent & former EMC members are heading to the Trump Network.
How is Kridder handling that one? Is he laughing about it….hahahahahahahahah
men and women of individual soverignty are leaving your lrh ass!
You and Shannon can sit around an talk about how we don’t know what we are talking about and discredit all we are saying but we know you read these blogs and know it is killing your internal dynamics.
Sorry but both of you screwed up when you started promoting Scientology…
Are you not proud of your religion?
Why not tell everyone that your scentologist?
Well I guess you can’t cause it would ruin you even more.
Sucks to be you right now!
What is Tony and his side kick Kevin Knecht going to do?
Are they going to claim their real religion or follow the short bus?
are they going to keep preaching everymorning or throw in the towell?
By the way these two have never made any real money and Tony is getting paid a private salary under a secret Non Disclosure agreement he cannot discuss…
How do I know? Cause I know how much the last Obie jockey got paid…
So Tony is totally getting a salary and going against his religious beliefs by promoting the scientologist regime!
That is even worse!
Prentending and posing as someone who you are not!
November 8th, 2009 at 9:38 am Douglas(Quote)
isn’t Life path , virtually the same thing , same overpriced products and seminars, just run by different people
November 8th, 2009 at 9:54 am Cripes!!(Quote)
Its not the “overpriced products or seminars” that is the problem, its all the BS about scientology and lack of integrity and lies about who they are and what they represent that is the problem.
Joe Neid (LPU) use to be part of LLI quite high up in the ranks and was apparently “let go” because of some illegal stuff – how true that is god only knows given all the Polaris EMC leaving to work with him now and the fact that that information came from current Polaris EMC members, so probably not true at all!!!
November 8th, 2009 at 3:58 pm Was Scammed(Quote)
Can’t get away from these scammers. My sister has just rung and said that there was a least one PMG exhibit at the Festival of the MindBodySpirit at Darling Harbour today. Just emailed the organizers to tell them what the NSW Department of Fair Trading thinks about this organization.
We need to make it impossible for these people who are still deluded to drag in more unfortunates.
November 9th, 2009 at 1:53 am Totally Discusted(Quote)
As a former LLI/Polaris associate I have to say I am totally appaulled by the link to scientology. I dont have a problem with any religion but I have a problem with a personal development company lying to people about its real intentions to recruit people into a religion. I have only been made aware of this the past few weeks but what blows me is EMC have known all along. I look back and realise how many of us were conned and manipulated by this ‘mind f%^k’ disguised as personal development. I hope the law, associates and the media wipe the floor with leadership that allowed this to happen. Really do they think everyone is stupid and not going to realise that the words ‘polaris’ ‘northstar’ and ‘evolution’ are all scientology words. Not one EMC I asked denied the link but they did try and convince people it was no big deal. EMC and Shane should be ashamed of themselves and as a result of their actions the masses are resigning. No crisis meeting can fix this, people have had enough!
November 9th, 2009 at 9:09 am iwonder(Quote)
Good stuff- this is EXACTLY the type of thing that needs to happen.
Alerting the organisers of events/media they advertise in etc as to DoFT etc.
November 9th, 2009 at 9:15 am Cripes!!(Quote)
Um not sure if any other Polaris people who are actively still involved (and reading this) realise that John Lavenia’s famous words that he lives by and rants at every opportunity – “Be At Cause And Not Effect” is a core principal of SCIENTOLOGY people!!!!
Now I am not saying that is all you need to say someone is guilty of scamming us all, but it does strengthen the “link” between the two, knowing that every bloody black belt marketing call and event he had where he spoke and that I was at this was all he went on about!!!!
November 9th, 2009 at 11:31 am DC(Quote)
Can anyone confirm the rumour that Sue Smart did not win the BMW but only a 2 year lease?
November 9th, 2009 at 11:40 am Cripes!!(Quote)
OMFG that is the funniest thing I have heard yet, surely that isn’t true!!! She is selling her other car now, she has an ad on facebook for it!! too funny hahahahaha
November 9th, 2009 at 12:02 pm Martin(Quote)
Surely a man that is responsible for a book titled ‘Integrity is everything’ cannot possibly be a scam artist??
On another note… anyone noticed how quiet Tony Rush has gone. For someone that usually has an opinion on every topic out there on all the mlm forums, he seems to have suddenly dropped off the planet.
Can’t think what Sue would do with another BMW… maybe give it to her personal trainer, gardener or chef for christmas??
After all she does say she makes $50k a month…
If ‘Sue from sydney’ says its true, then it must be!
Oh hang on… wasn’t Sue told to ‘tone it down’ on the business overview calls ’cause she was scaring off prospects with her over the top testimonials??
November 9th, 2009 at 12:06 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
As a former associate I totally agree, you should read the sh!^ that I have received from my advisor acting like a dumb ass like she didn’t know what I was on about, stupid b!tch.
I agree with everything you say and to be honest I cannot believe that Today Tonight hasn’t jumped on the band wagon with some sort of story, we all know how funny and trashy that show can be. This is right up their ally!!
November 9th, 2009 at 12:08 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Luv it, so freakin’ funny!!!!
November 9th, 2009 at 12:21 pm Martin(Quote)
Igf you think thats funny… Have you seen Sue n’ Jerrys (former) nowucan2 partner Carmen on the Australian Apprentice?..
She’s been getting some flak from some of the people she owes money to.. http://anthillonline.com/the-real-dirt-on-the-apprentice-australia-or-is-that-pay-dirt/
November 9th, 2009 at 12:25 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
You guys care to fill us in on the BMW stuff?
Some of us don’t know the particulars
.
November 9th, 2009 at 12:32 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
well I’m no authority on this because I wasn’t at the last conference however I do know that we had this “sizzling summer showdown” that went from May to September (I think it was) where basically the top 10 or 15 advisors (dont remember exact numbers) who sold the most Beyond Freedom Programs/Conferences won all these prizes. The “Smarties” earned/sold the most and the top prize was this hot BMW convertible. That is the basics, again I wasn’t at the conference so don’t know full details. Its piss funny though if it is true about a lease, surely not!!
November 9th, 2009 at 12:33 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
I believe ACA or TT can’t remember which already did a story on Liberty League covering Six Figure Chicks I think it was. Basic angle was about how great it all was that mums were being all independant and entrepenurial.
I guess they won’t be doing a followup as a. it’ll make them look bad, b. up until recently their parent networks (9) were making advertising dollars off of LLI/Polaris and c. it’d emphasise the fact that somebody didn’t do their homework first time around.
November 9th, 2009 at 12:41 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Yeah I remember seeing that one to. I don’t think they would care that a story was previously done, this deception only came to light because of the change in September and EMC/CCC members not conforming and leaving and spilling the beans, so thank f$%k for them!! This story on 6 figure chicks was run prior to the changes! And in Rania’s defense she had no idea what was going on, she was one of the ones that left just recently when she found out the truth!!
November 9th, 2009 at 12:44 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
OMFG I watch that show and for past 4 weeks have been trying to work out where the hell I know her from…. that is tooo funny!!!! Oh hang on she says shes lost everything, thats not because of all this sh!t is it?? Thats not cool at all!
November 9th, 2009 at 1:04 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
I couldn’t let this one slip… from that anthill link:
WHERE DO I SIGN UP?!?
November 9th, 2009 at 1:26 pm DC(Quote)
Didn’t Carmen get fired from the show last week?
November 9th, 2009 at 1:28 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
yeah she did, I would love to hear her story about LLI/Polaris!
November 9th, 2009 at 2:40 pm Martin(Quote)
Isn’t she lucky to have Sue n’ Jerry as former business partners… they can give her the loan of their old BMW while she’s looking for a job or, better still, give her a job!
November 9th, 2009 at 2:55 pm Martin(Quote)
http://www.superbiz.com.au/meet.html
Carmens website for anyone who’s interested
November 9th, 2009 at 5:14 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Lisa how do you know all this???
November 9th, 2009 at 5:36 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
OMG are u serious? I love you Lisa you know everything and have all the dirt lol!!
November 10th, 2009 at 4:16 am Lisa Mcpherson(Quote)
Allegedly and I quote, this could be hearsay, but the differing sources have confirmed. I will paraphrase in quotes what was told to me at one of our events.
“Lisa Molina slept with other males outside of her husband that were either owners of LLI or EMC.” I believe their were three owners of LLI back then… I don’t know the third’s name, but I was told it was all three owners.
“There were different orgies going on during the first few years of LLI and Shane and Michele were allegedly involved with their nanny on one of them.”
These quotes were brought out by scientology auditing and apparently Lisa apologized to the wives of these men and it was the prelude to Brent’s divorce, but because Michele was involved it did not bother her.
These are direct quotes from high ups at least 5 years ago.
The bottom line is Brent and Shane had a great vision, but they really didn’t know about real integrity based personal development.
They helped create some great leaders, but all of them have left…Why?
Now that Shane feels like he is in real spiritual God Like harmony he is promoting scientology, which was the decision of death for PMG.
Scientology was the worst thing he could have ever promoted.
“Not a big deal” the current EMC are saying…
ARE YOU KIDDING ME?
You guys have lost your minds…
THERE ARE GOOD PEOPLE IN EMC RIGHT NOW THAT MUST SEPARATE FROM PMG…
PMG WILL RUIN YOU!
Shane is probably now giving his internal speech to himself…
“I will prospect myself if I have to.”
GO FOR IT and start confusing the hell out of people manipulating people onto a path of debt destruction and regret.
Shane I gotta hand it to you for being one of the best manipulators ever!
Heres an article to promote PMG
Join Polaris Media Group Now!
How to loose $50k in 6 months!
http://www.PolarisMediaGroup.com
If you personally want to help save people from PMG, blog about their link to Scientology.
This is their weak point.
They cannot escape this, however you must only do it in Australia blogs, because USA blogs they have their Scientology attorneys onto it and are threatening with Lawsuits to owners of blogs, however they cannot touch OZ’s blog cause he is Australia! At least yet…
Are these people really bad or good people led astray, brainwashed the wrong way by professional manipulators…
Let’s call it what it is…
Professionals manipulated by even better professional manipulators.
John, Shannon, Shane and the other owner (the video guy) are the master blue print manipulators.
Tony, Gene, Carla, Debbie, Rachel, Lisa, Bob and whomever else are just professional loyal followers who really don’t think for themselves.
Sorry guys, but you are all riding the short bus with no windows– a driver named Shane — and a meaty disciplinarian in the front seat named Shannon.
Think about that on your next EMC trip.
Well maybe Shane and Shannon will be separate in a LIMO and you will just get short bus privileges…
Lisa
November 10th, 2009 at 12:19 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
OMG Lisa that is crazy talk lol but p!ss funny!
Well I have contacted ACCC and given details and Fair Trading NSW because that is where the Polaris Media Group is registered in Australia (FYI!) just a matter of sitting back now to see what happens. Also there has been talk of Class Action, has anyone investigated this further, whats the deal so far on this???
November 10th, 2009 at 2:05 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
I think with the class action, there’s a lot of people talking about it but nothing has been launched yet.
I imagine Polaris would fight any such action and/or just try to palm it off to the distributor/s. This is where I think launching an action against them isn’t as straight forward as taking another company to court.
November 10th, 2009 at 2:18 pm iwonder(Quote)
The main key, I believe, is to inform as many people as possible about the true nature of this scheme.
After everyone knows the true motives, and member numbers get lower (as is happening now)- Polaris will be a blip on the radar, and will disappear- just as Liberty League did.
Now, as far as recovering money you have spent, perhaps the best thing to do is to seek legal advice.
If anyone comes back with details of class action, they can of course notify others and it will go from there.
What do you guys think?
November 10th, 2009 at 7:27 pm Vince(Quote)
For those without access to Tony “Delete” Rush’s forum, here’s my favourite at the moment, courtesy of “Steve Smith”:
The “gathering of the gullible”… I love that… sums up Polaris nicely. He should’ve also mentioned Scientology, that would get Tony’s blood boiling.
November 10th, 2009 at 11:21 pm Todd Omond(Quote)
Hi All
I’m a staff member at the Church of Scientology. A bona fide religion recognized by the High Court of Australia. I find the above insults to be vilification of my religious beliefs. That is now a criminal act. Akin to racist abuse. We have nothing to hide, whether it’s WISE or Narconon or Criminon, or any community betterment program. We believe in making a world without insanity, crime and war.
I’ve got no affiliation to Polaris, but shouldn’t all you cynics read for yourselves the material in question before you form a judgement.
I want to help others do better in life. Do you?
Regards
Todd
November 10th, 2009 at 11:59 pm Roly(Quote)
@LL and now Polaris winner
Blah blah indeed. Who are you talking to/about? Most of my ventures have been *winners*, but I smelled a rat withing 60 seconds of encountering LLI, and your expression of blind optimism is a good example of why.
I’ll give you a protip for free, the good bits of a business drive you, it’s the bad bits that you have to concentrate on fixing.
It seems that no one associated with these companies wants to face up to simple realities. “Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead” only works in the movies. In real life such macho optimalism is a good way to get blown up.
@iwonder
is right that it is important to keep up a warning flag for potential new victims, but there is also the matter of those already victimised by this scam.
It’s not rocket surgery. Class-action? First there are some prliminaries;
1) Get organised. Who is going to put their hand up to co-ordinate communication between victims? Develop an e-group. Something like a closed by-invitation page where you can freely discuss your options.
2) Get advice. That e-group can then seek real expert advice from someone who actually knows what they are talking about (and some firms like Slater & Gordon will take on class actions pro bono or no-win-no-fee). Is your case a winner, even money, or a no-hoper?
3) Then the group decides if it is willing and able to act on whatever that advice is.
Do it.
November 11th, 2009 at 12:17 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Sooooo you want people to respect your beliefs by claiming their beliefs are a criminal act.
Rightio, let us know how that works out for you. The UN already tried this blasphemy bullshit and failed.
November 11th, 2009 at 1:28 am iwonder(Quote)
???
What are these people on?
Seriously.
Yes- hence this thread and topic, which has saved the sanity and bank balance of many.
Unfortunately Todd, there will always be people who disagree with your beliefs. Of my beliefs. Of Joe Bloggs down the road’s beliefs.
Scientology (as I am sure you know) does attract alot of criticism. Google it. See what you come up with. Then email all of them or post on their blogs if you are so inclined.
The basis here is a group (PMG) which you admit you are not involved with personally, and their deception. I have restrained myself quite a bit in regard to my views about Scientology and I am sure others have done the same.
November 11th, 2009 at 2:27 am HC(Quote)
Never thought I would be hearing and reading all this stuff a year ago after I signed and fell into place. Mind control is a very interesting thing. Some good ideas (Beyond Freedom, Principals of Religion) can really be manipulated. The “leaders” take control and all the followers just get in line. I fell for it but was a good lesson Been checking in on some of the team calls that are still up and there seems to be so much confusion in the “leadership”. Wonder if Scientology will get their attorneys on this. Would be interesting since they are so secretive. Hope more people will really look at the game plan before they start to play. Wish this site was available before I got involved. It was a fair idea to me back in early 2008, but I did not question enough. I can see somehow with the backing of Scientology that PMG will possibly thrive and get more recruits, but they should be told what they are getting into. Wondering how long the connection with Scientology has been in place.
November 11th, 2009 at 9:54 am Boris(Quote)
$cientology may have nothing to hide but finding out can cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars. The front organisations run by $cientology are there to drag the vulnerable into the morass. http://www.xenu.net/archive/scientology_illustrated/intro13.htm This will outline their crazy beliefs and doesn’t cost a cent.
November 11th, 2009 at 4:03 pm Roly(Quote)
Oops, “preliminaries”
@Todd Omond
“A bona fide religion”? My posterior. It’s one thing to conjecture that we might have alien origins, quite another to claim to have their phone number, then try to sell it digit-by-digit. In private Hubbard must have laughed until he choked.
Inference: the Catholic Church shouldn’t be held accountable for institutionalised child abuse because they are a religion???
I also demand respect for my rights as a Heretic without portfolio to rip into anyone with an invisible friend and a magic book. Bugger Alien-Lib; they don’t vote or pay taxes, so stuff ‘em. As non-smokers want a world free of smoke, so atheists want a world free of mirrors.
Next thing will be Scientologists demanding that special cubicles be added to all public toilets with an “X” on the door so the aliens won’t be discriminated against when they want to take a leak (or whatever it is that aliens must do in private).
{Oh yeah, almost forgot; I’m taking advance orders for my SteamPunk re-creation of a Mk-III electrometer, normally $2200 plus shipping, this advance offer on a limited series signed by the builder is being discounted by 10% to a flat $2000 including shipping – for a limited time only! Get in now and secure your unit – never to be repeated offer.}
LOST MONEY IN LLI? THEN LISTEN UP!
One thing you all have in common is a self-image of a get-up-and-go can-do’er.
Well where the hell is your get-up and can-do NOW?
A handful going to the ACCC or Fair Trading individually is ignorable. The same people beating the shubbery as a co-ordinated action will have a much greater effect. Pull it all together in one place you’ve got a multi-million dollar fraud.
The whole fraud is cynically constructed to exploit your “rape shame” to the fullest. It’s entirely your fault you walked down that street, and if you didn’t fight hard enough, you deserve what you got.
@Rod and @iwonder at least have some moxie. How ’bout it guys? Who’s going to give some practical expression to all that “awsome” Personal Development? Who’s going to take the bit between their teeth?
November 11th, 2009 at 5:48 pm iwonder(Quote)
@Roly
Wheels are in motion Roly.
Let the games begin.
November 11th, 2009 at 8:28 pm Edward(Quote)
I have a career, have done for 15yrs,told you that before.Got a job,own a home,put my kids through uni, Get a life!
November 12th, 2009 at 7:47 am iwonder(Quote)
Edward- great, fantastic, wonderful, excellent etc etc.
Are you done now?
Back to the matter at hand- more people have left. It seems people that have signed up are now also actively warning others that seek them out on old advertisements etc. Love it!
Keep up the great work guys.
November 12th, 2009 at 3:49 pm iwonder(Quote)
In reference to this ridiculous comment also:
To compare having an opinion about Scientology to racial abuse is mind boggling.
You CHOSE to be a Scientologist.
You CHOSE to represent an extremely controversial organisation that has alot of bad press worldwide.
You CHOSE to represent an organisation that charges ridiculous amounts of money for their “courses”.
You CHOSE to represent an organisation that claims we are all from a planet near the North Star (Polaris).
You CHOSE to represent an organisation that has recently come under fire here in Australia due to the death of a soldier.
People do not choose to be a certain race. Get real “Todd”.
November 12th, 2009 at 4:01 pm Martin(Quote)
You tell’ em iwonder!
Im sure you’re related to my missus.
November 12th, 2009 at 4:09 pm iwonder(Quote)
aaaaaahahaha….
I choose my battles Martin
November 12th, 2009 at 5:33 pm Greg(Quote)
Hi all
I have been contacting new Polaris members on facebook and suggesting they do some research before committing any more money. I have had a few responses so far and have been forwarding this sights link. Been careful not to incriminate myself though. Don’t want there lawyers on my case! Also thanks again OZ.
November 12th, 2009 at 5:57 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Nice work Greg, you might also want to mention that the Aus BOC’s in the evening are all staged and made to look like there is heaps of associates on the call, when there isn’t!!
No associates were getting on the Business Overview Calls to give testimonials because everyone was leaving Polaris!! So they started a Skype Group to try to ensure they had testimonials to give at each Aus BOC.
Problem was though that this was happening only in the evening which is why the Aus BOC’s were dead during the day because no one was in the Skype room trying to create the “wall of sound”. The advisor doing the call kept putting it down to “technical issues” and people couldn’t “ummute” to give their testimonials, that was BS, there was no one calling in to give them!!
I was part of this group, so I know first hand what was going on. People would get in the group on Skype and they would create a list of who was giving testimonials so the advisor taking the call knew who to call out, so if you weren’t in the Skype group chances of being called out to give your testimonial were slim to none. They were also trying to create that “wall of sound” like there was heaps of associates on the line waiting to give testimonials, when really there was about 10 people total and majority of those are only new to the business!!
Same with the Black Belt Marketing call of John Lavenia’s, when he “opens the lines” for everyone to scream and get all excited at the beginning of the call and pump up his ego some more…… there was a total of 10 people and he acknowledges that and says its a technical issue people are on delayed phone lines or cant unmute…. total BS its because no one wants to listen to his dribble anymore!!
November 12th, 2009 at 7:06 pm iwonder(Quote)
LOVE IT!
November 12th, 2009 at 7:45 pm Roly(Quote)
@iwonder
Good to hear.
Keep your powder dry, but keep us informed when you can, eh?
November 13th, 2009 at 1:18 am lisa(Quote)
Want to make a big impact?
Google has to pick this up front page, when you type in Polaris Media Group.
Here is how you do it…
Use facebook, libertyleaguelife.ning.com, squidoo, myspace, twitter, and find any blog out there and paste this…
Polaris Media Group http://www.polarismediagroup.com Is Now Publicly Linked To Scientology.
Shane Krider & Shannon Lavenia Are Actively Promoting All Memmbers To Join Church Of Scientology.
See For Yourself First Hand:
http://ozsoapbox.com/personal/liberty-league/polaris-media-group-publicly-linked-to-scientology/
These sites are fronts for scientology and polaris media group.
ShannonLavenia.com
November 13th, 2009 at 1:30 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
In the interests of credibility I’d rather people weren’t spamming OzSoapbox all around the internet.
I’m sure nearly everyone involved in Polaris is aware of the site already and for anyone doing their own research finding the information here is (hopefully) easy enough.
Google has a way of ranking relevant information and seems to think the info here is alright, we don’t need to go resort to Polaris spam-bomb tacticts to get the info out there.
I do appreciate the thought though thankyou.
November 13th, 2009 at 4:52 am Philip(Quote)
Although I am not a member of PMG or scientology I must say that I hate blogs like this. Not so much because of the infomration but the comments.
This is a meeting of the weak trying to be heroes. Everyone is now a guru on why this or that wont work or why this book or that idea is off the mark.
The questions is how much have you accomplished in your life? What impact have you made?
These blogs are filled with the words of low level thinking people “run far away” and “I was scammed” is typical and can be found on every single blog of the sort.
Why would you all spend so much time following PMG? Do you not have your own lives to run?
In addition all of you who “lost money” and want to blame someone else for your greed should take some responsibility for yourself. You joined the thing hoping to get others to pay you and blow there money too. Truth is you are just too weak to do it. But if you did make money we would not see you on this blog, would we?
Who cares if PMG is linked to scientology. Scientology is along the same lines as many books and teachings that have become so popular lately. Metaphysics, psycho cybernetics, ect. It is all based in personal development which you all are oviously not doing.
Blogs like these are the flocking together of low level, low consiousnous people who never take responsibility for themselves, never work hard to get what they want, and are constantly blaming others for their lives.
You buy the magic pills instead of going to the gym and eating properly. You buy into every money making scheme thinking you are going to earn real money working 1 hour a day. You buy all the gimmicks on tv infomrercials.
The very best thing you can do for yourself is not associate yourself with this level of people. You must increase your level.
Why do you think that every company on earth has a inner circle of executives that do not share secret info with you? Because you are not on that level.
Leave people alone to do what ever they will do. What PMG or the scientologists are doing is no more harmful than being an unproductive low level meember of society.
There is no right or wrong good or bad. Leave them alone.
For once focus on your life and go accomplish soemthing for God sake.
November 13th, 2009 at 11:18 am Vince(Quote)
Kids in America running through schools with a gun killing random people has become popular too. So what?
Well I’m sure we agree there. PMG is the magic pill and gimmick that promises the world but delivers crap.
November 13th, 2009 at 12:07 pm Martin(Quote)
Welcome to the real world Philip.
Truth is, if you dont like blogs like this you just need to ‘change the channel’.
‘Lonely’ Rush likes to use the ‘magic pills’ comment too. Actually the whole of your post could have come from Mr. Rush. Actually… Are you Mr. Rush??
November 13th, 2009 at 5:45 pm Greg(Quote)
Hey Oz
Understand, didnt think of it that way. Will not post the link next time.Got some positive responses though.
November 13th, 2009 at 5:54 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
No worries Greg glad you got some response.
People getting information out there of their own accord is ok but when we start encouraging others to spam Facebook et al. just for the sake of it we lower ourselves to their level (remember the Polaris launch and call to spam their site everywhere from leaders?)
A while back I had someone sign up to a whole bunch of Polaris sites and use my OSB email, needless to say some associates thought it was me and I had to fire off a bunch of ‘sorry someone’s playing funny buggers’ emails when the associates queried it.
As much as I disagree with the business model behind Polaris I’m not about to start hounding their associates.
November 14th, 2009 at 11:28 am Douglas(Quote)
found this on Facebook , a newbie asking questions
” hi ya wot do u all do, i mean how do you work, do u have to openly sell products, does it cost me lots to do it? how much do i have to speculate to accumulate, ive had my phone calls and ect but im still not understanding what id have to do please help me out.
“you need to do is to share the opportunity and get them to listen the business overview call. the system does all the explaining.”
9 hours ago ·
give them $25,000 – its so easy and yes they will take it from you – oh and then there ismarketing – that cost me $10,000 in the last 12 months – and of course they love you because the only ones that will make any money will be the EMC – this is a very elaberate scam – there are class actions against them globally
be warned
5 hours ago · you can’t say anything good xxxxx just shut up. you’re not doing any good in this community. just mind your own business
4 hours ago · it is not working for you xxxx you’re doing it all wrong…
3 hours ago · xxxxxx experienced in this and want to ehlp newbies. I am doing nothing wrong at all – I have a free mind – that is a clue
3 hours ago · xxxxxxx you haven’t establish any credibility in this community.
3 hours ago · xxxxxx and what credibility do you have, with respect?
November 14th, 2009 at 11:51 am Cripes!!(Quote)
I have been following this conversation to. There is also another lengthy conversation on that wall and this morning the same person who asked “3 hours ago · xxxxxx and what credibility do you have, with respect?” asked if this was scientology and quickly had their question removed. IF they have nothing to hide they shouldn’t be deleting these questions!
November 14th, 2009 at 12:11 pm iwonder(Quote)
hahahahaha…I thought the same thing!
November 15th, 2009 at 3:12 pm Greg(Quote)
Hey Philip
If I help one person see the light before they are scammed by this fraudulent company, I will be satisfied. I learn from my mistakes and hopefully I can pass on a little wisdom to others.
Thanks to Oz I get that chance.
November 15th, 2009 at 3:35 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Yeah Greg I know what you mean, not only that I see that you have either been kicked off the FB page or your comments have all been deleted! Again, if they had nothing to hide they wouldnt be deleting these comments!
November 15th, 2009 at 9:02 pm wakeup(Quote)
Hey Phillip – do you know Tony Rush?
November 16th, 2009 at 7:41 am also the truth(Quote)
I have been removed also – what a pack of control freaks and reading through the PMG page in BF it is very disturbing to see all the posts from thos poor ppl being sucked
Roger
November 16th, 2009 at 7:54 am Douglas(Quote)
i think you can still post on Facebook , problems is they will probably delete the so called negative stuff, what the heck , just post anyways , someone will still get to read it, even if it still gets taken down
November 16th, 2009 at 9:55 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
If you’re posting to the Polaris Media Group ‘group’ on Facebook then yes they will have an admin team for the group removing your posts. This is similar to how the Polaris Ning group runs with Tony Rush as a moderator, same sort of deal.
Facebook itself isn’t stopping you from posting or banning you, the Polaris admins of the group are.
November 16th, 2009 at 11:27 am Coco(Quote)
If the Scientology conspiracy theory you’re spouting is not true, then what you are writing is libel, which there are laws against. So yeah, the libeled party would want to delete that for ya. If it is true, it really needs to be proven by legal, professional investigation and brought to light publicly, which will be more powerful than vigilante expose justice in the form of defamation anyway. You could try “Facebooking” some legal representatives and get them on the case for you instead of posting where your target will only squelch your slander. If you really want to “save” people, why not be bold about it and make an actual, legitimate effort, not just cop out with cheap shots on PMG’s FB. . . “Accomplish something” like Phillip, the talking head for Mr. Rush suggested. Put your actions behind your mouth and see if you’re actually onto something that can be proven in a court of law, then all this blogging actually comes to some good and isn’t all talk. Just a thought . . . who will do it?
November 16th, 2009 at 12:04 pm Peter Diprose(Quote)
As a recently resigned associate I find all of this information both extremely interesting and disturbing.
Interesting because the Polaris community supposedly promotes strong lines of communication, honesty and integrity. Disturbing because, as evidenced by myself and others here, they also discourage communication (don’t network with people outside your direct team line)or just do not provide it.
I personally decided to leave because I could not make the business model work. I personally could not care less whether they are Scientologists, Methodists or Episcopalians. What concerns me is that they have certainly lied to us all.
On a recent Team Down-Under wake up call the question of preferences for religious beliefs was raised and laughed off. An Aussie EMC member in Arizona affirmed online that he was not in the USA for indoctrination, merely assisting with marketing ideas and I for one was prepared to believe him. In fact I really don’t care whether he is or isn’t being “converted” – that ultimately is his own personal choice and good luck to him.
What I object to is the deception and coercion employed throughout the company. I have asked for a refund of my original investment – A$26K – and been told that there are no refunds unless cancellations are/were made within specific timelines. I’m in the process of trying to find out from PMG what these timelines were / are.
I have neither booked nor attended any events and therefore believe that I am entitled to some if not all of my original investment. I am currently seeking legal advice and it is my intention to pursue the matter through the courts. If there is an existing class action I would be interested to have reference to it (or join with it if that offers me and the other claimants an advantage). I have listed my full name and my contact details are available via this site if requested.
Is this sour grapes? I don’t think so. If I had invested money in a profitable venture elsewhere but had decided to recover my investment it would be no different. I think a previous comment that the “shame factor” plays a large part in keeping such organisations out of the spotlight is very true. I for one am prepared to stand up and be counted. I stuffed up, fair call. Doesn’t mean I have to continue to be rooted.
November 16th, 2009 at 1:03 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Well I didn’t doctor the Lavenia facebook screen shot nor tell John to promote Scientology books. Given the association between Polaris and Scientology was publicly viewable it’s not like I had to go out of my way to write about it.
Additionally for it to be libel one part of the scientology equation has to be the ‘negative association’. So which is it, does Scientology make Polaris look bad or does Polaris make Scientology look bad?
Oh the conundrum!
November 16th, 2009 at 2:16 pm wakeup(Quote)
Coco – if it were not true do you not think they would
a) say so
b) leave the comments there as proof of libel?
November 16th, 2009 at 6:25 pm Roly(Quote)
@Philip
Same old script yet again from someone who isn’t associated {blahblahblah]. Stunningly arrogant assumptions, and ending with pure nonsense;
You mean that the next time you step into a lift or aircraft you don’t care if the designer, mechanic, or pilot are good or bad?
Apart from being a volunteer most of my life, including bushfire fighting, my critical view of the LLI/PMG pyramid model is grounded in considerable achievements for many satisfied clients in professional relationships that lasted years.
It is exactly this sort of Kool-Aid spray from the faithful that confirms my view of rampant arrogant New-Age cluelessness.
@Coco
This claim interests me. Please explain how associating the Church of Scientology with Liberty League International or Polaris Media Group *defames* the latter?
-
Spotted some “Executive Salary” bandit signs over Caroline Springs (Melb) way yesterday.
@Peter Diprose
Good post.
November 16th, 2009 at 6:59 pm Vince(Quote)
Exactly. The people at the top are scientologists. If you put two and two together, you will realise that to get to the top of the pyramid (if that’s even possible), you will need to be a scientologist, hence the secrecy. If (most) people knew they’d have to “practice” scientology to be one of the Polaris Media Group leaders, they wouldn’t join at all.
November 17th, 2009 at 7:58 am iwonder(Quote)
Yes, ans Shannon Lavenia is one of them.
She showed people at “Super Saturday” (read Super ripoff) as she logged into the group via projector.
Also- if this organisation is so great- why are there only 2000 fans in the ENTIRE WORLD?? And why do they all seem to be BRAND NEW??
What amuses me is they leave commets like this (which had a link to a web article at the top)- completely ignoring the questions about Scientology and repeating the same vague crap about what you actually DO:
Stella Morganso: what is the strategy that members of this group use?
Anne Moore: Polaris “has the tools to finance your passions” and the strategy is to provide individuals who have the desire to create a better life for themselves with the education to actually “create their own future”
Stella Morganso: so uts like life coaching, not scientology?
Karen Phillips: i like this article – work smart!
November 17th, 2009 at 8:04 am Cripes!!(Quote)
What is even funnier… did you notice the Polaris Media Group that you have to “Request To Join” and can’t just automatically add yourself has only 882 members!!! What does that say! I think this one that has just over 2000 has a lot of people still in it who are no longer a part of Polaris but want to keep up with the dirt like we do!!
November 17th, 2009 at 8:10 am iwonder(Quote)
Absolutely. The one with 2000 (which is still a VERY low number for something so apparently fantastic and revolutionary) has quite a few people on there just to check out what is happening and warn others who are brand new and caught in the headlights.
November 17th, 2009 at 3:23 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
They are everywhere people…. just had the TV on in the background while hear working and heard one of the contestants on Ready Steady Cook spruking about her home based in personal development based on The Secret and Law Of Attraction….. they are everywhere!! Hoping they don’t let her talk anymore about it or announce her business name!!
November 17th, 2009 at 4:25 pm Douglas(Quote)
So i’m asking some questions about Polaris on Facebbok eg , how much have you made etc etc …all deleted …what a joke , talk about nothing to hide , so you guys who have lost your money have you gone to A Current Affair , etc etc to complain
November 17th, 2009 at 5:22 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
ok so im going to ask a really “dumb” question but how do you go to A Current Affair or Today Tonight to complain about these things or tell them that you have a scam/story for them??
November 17th, 2009 at 5:30 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
the things you wish for…… my husband has just told me he has the email address for the Producer of Today Tonight because they use it for their stories. So anyone on here who is interested in being part of the story or has information they would love to share you can contact me!!
November 17th, 2009 at 5:41 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Cripes
LOL. I hope they didn’t ask her too many questions, she’d might have had to tell them to get on a call
.
These guys can be contacted via their respective websites. Just punch in either name into Google and look for a ‘contact us’ section.
Good luck! A few have tried to get ACA/TT to look at it but seem to have been knocked back. Main reason from what I can gather was TT did a positive story on LLI a while ago and Ch9 is (was?) receiving advertising dollars via television ads (UXL etc).
@Douglas
I’m guessing Polaris run their Facebook site the same as they do their intrapersonal marketing. Answer nothing and get people onto calls so you can wow them with excitement hype and possibly get them to commit on the spot.
November 18th, 2009 at 1:32 am James(Quote)
Senator Nick Xenophon says Scientology is ‘a criminal organisation’
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,26365915-421,00.html
November 18th, 2009 at 1:45 am Roly(Quote)
@Cripes!!
You may get more traction with The Age investigation or Insight team, whatever they call it now. Surf their site, e-mail people about it, follow up with phonecalls.
November 18th, 2009 at 7:50 am iwonder(Quote)
This comment has now disappeared from the page.
November 18th, 2009 at
[...] Group associates. Polaris Media Group being a MLM sales company operating in Australia and recently publicly linked to Scientology [...]
November 18th, 2009 at
[...] news of Polaris Media Group distributors promoting Scientology courses broke, it wasn’t long before Elena resigned. As You well know, My vision is to educate, train [...]
November 19th, 2009 at 6:07 am Wendy(Quote)
Wow, you know what people. This board is just a feeding ground for people who like to dwell on the negative in life and blame all their circumstances on something external. Scientology or not… who cares? The principles of the product work and if those principles help people then that’s good. Some pay for a university education, get qualified then never use their qualification… some even borrow money to do it. This is no different. you are buying a product, an education in personal development. Where you buy it from or who is of little consequence.
All of you on this board should be directing your energies into just having a great day, and making the most of today. Negative energy is just not worth it.
Have an awesome day everyone!
November 19th, 2009 at 10:48 am wakeup(Quote)
Hey Wendy
The principles of the Beyond Freedom product work, as many people on this blog have attested to. The point you seem to have not grasped is that it is morally and ethically wrong to promote personal development products based on Scientology principles without being up front about it and giving people the opportunity to KNOW FOR YOURSELF before choosing to invest. Those that pay for a university education know exactly what they are paying for. Those that pay for products from Polaris do not.
and you have a great day too!
November 19th, 2009 at 10:55 am iwonder(Quote)
No, it is a great form of FREE speech- a concept you at PMG seem to have forgotten. It is also a great way to warn people against being ripped off by people such as yourself.
Er…..quite alot of people it seems. Not just within PMG…
Really? Well please see my post introducing my new “religion” The Intergalactic Bullshit Group. I will let you join….only if you give me 20k and promise to “think” your profits into actuality. If they do not eventuate, you only have yourself to blame. Oh- and you will need to sign a confidentiality clause as well.
Please explain- I am all ears
November 19th, 2009 at 12:46 pm Martin(Quote)
The following comment is currently on PMG facebook… no doubt will be deleted shortly:
“This Business (if you can call it that) is a scam.Tonnes of empty promises, nothing delivered! They just take your money and run. EMC are jumping ship to other home business’ left right and centre and new associates leaving in droves. I know personally of 60 people who have left in the last week or so.I was at the Puer…to Rico conference in October and it is just a very expensive sham!! The scientology link is another thing all together. But you should check out google on that subject and read for yourself.Look elsewhere for other business’ with some integrity!! They are removing any negative comments ASAP- but hope someone gets to see this and is saved from financial disaster!!”
@Wendy.. if the product and the company are soo good why are there so many people disgruntled? Why are there so many of the EMC bailing out? Why do they delete rather than address questions posted to their social media sites?
You have a really super super awesome day too!
November 19th, 2009 at 1:02 pm Rachel(Quote)
HaHaHa i’m loving looking at the FB page…
November 19th, 2009 at 1:58 pm Mezza(Quote)
Me too! I’ll give it another hour…
November 20th, 2009 at 5:18 pm Douglas(Quote)
someones letting lose on Face book , someone has admitted to following Scientology
November 20th, 2009 at 7:54 pm jenko(Quote)
yeah, i see what you mean. Could be a fake profile tho…?
November 20th, 2009 at 9:19 pm wakeup(Quote)
Missed that one – but look at this:
The cracks are appearing….
November 21st, 2009 at 1:20 am Greg(Quote)
Hi all,
Just received an e-mail from Elena Fraga. She has confirmed that she has left PMG. Sorry OZ had to double check for myself.
November 24th, 2009 at 12:32 pm Val(Quote)
I know for a fact (having spoken to former EMC members) that Shane Krider, the Lavinias, the Molinas, Rachel Oliver, Delwyn McKenzie & others are openly Scientologists.
Polaris is a Scientology company, fact.
They don’t provide any real training or mentoring & once you have spent the big bucks they aren’t interested.
LLI was pretty good, Beyond Freedom was great… but Polaris is a sham.
November 24th, 2009 at 12:47 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
And I know for a fact the reason Brent Payne left when he did, are for the same reasons the Hamburgers and Swans did, didn’t want to follow Shane’s path towards scientology!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!
November 25th, 2009 at 2:44 pm Kirk Reed(Quote)
Wow! This was quite a thread! lol As an ex-scientologist I would just like to thank you all from the bottom of my heart for exposing this company.
I noticed the scilons (:)) were doing what they always do…attacking and trying to demean anyone who didn’t agree with them. So typical.
Let me just say a couple of things. Scientology is not in ANY way a religion. L.Ron Hubbard discovered that he could get tax exemption and avoid FDA regulations by using religion as a cloak. I was there when the big push was on to get the IRS to give them tax exemption. It’s all a lie.
Scientologists are infamous for starting AND joining MLM’s. I saw at least 30 of them come and go while I was a scilon. I even got taken by a couple. Scilon’s don’t mind scamming other scilons at all.
One of the scilons on here was bawwwing about those who were scammed taking responsibility for being conned. They want everyone else to take resposibility but just try and get one of them to do the same! All hell breaks loose. The same with their “church”. Anything that goes wrong is the member’s fault, never scientology’s. If a member complains or speaks out about something it’s just because they themselves have crimes according to the “church.” It could NEVER be the “church’s” fault!
As weird as you think scientology is right now…you ain’t seen nothing yet.
November 25th, 2009 at 2:50 pm iwonder(Quote)
Great post Kirk
Can you shed some more light on these other companies/ MLM’s?
November 25th, 2009 at 2:54 pm Kirk Reed(Quote)
Well, I got involved with a coupon thing, they do tons of vitamin MLM’s, Amway type things…you name it. I’m an old fogey and can’t remember all of them though.
They need a lot of money to get up their little “bridge” so anything that looks quick is what they really love. Get in, get out, leave the poor schmucks with a room full of fire detectors.
And they call themselves the most ethical people on the planet!
November 25th, 2009 at 7:46 pm Columbo(Quote)
It’s me again. Don’t know if anyone else got the email, but Shane Krider has emailed all associates last night and admitted he is a scientologist. So it’s finally out.
………Just one more thing……Does that mean this thread is now dead??
Ok just realised your on to it in a new thread OZ.
November 25th, 2009 at 8:19 pm Pat(Quote)
And what of it? His email only served to point out how petty all this crap is. What gives anyone the right to sit in judgement over someone else about what they believe in. All you people on this soapbox that are so worried about this scientology stuff should just get a life. Colombo also failed to mention that Shanes email stated that the business was “a business”. Not scientology, but a full fledged business. Anyone of any rank, religion, sex, colour, sexual orientation whatever is permitted in the business. Personal beliefs are not a criteria. So time to get off your soap boxes folks. It’s all old news now.
November 25th, 2009 at 8:25 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Pat
Who’s personal beliefs do you think are behind the Polaris products…?
They didn’t just write themselves.
November 25th, 2009 at 8:27 pm iwonder(Quote)
Yes, and I am Santa Claus.
Ha- Are you serious? Really?
It’s only just beginning
Ps: I feel for you if you STILL haven’t woken up to Krider and the EMC (are you one of them btw?) ‘s motives. I am not quite sure what it would take to wake you up.
November 25th, 2009 at 8:36 pm wakeup(Quote)
@ Pat – at least everyone now has the opportunity to KNOW FOR THEMSELVES whether or not they wish to be involved in a business run by Scientologists, an exercise some PERSONAL SOVEREIGNITY.
November 25th, 2009 at 9:31 pm Martin(Quote)
You have got to be kidding!
Do you seriously expect people to believe that anyone who signed up as a distributor for PolarisMediaGroup, fully believing that they were buying into a business based on the teachings of The Secret, are now just going to carry on as if nothing has happened??
Do you seriously believe that distributors are going to keep promoting the products knowing now that most of the proceeds will be channeled into Scientology?
Next you’ll be expecting us all to believe that mankind’s origins involve an alien overlord named Xenu…. think about it… this is what your CEO believes in!!
Krider is insane!! You’re all INSANE!!
November 25th, 2009 at 10:35 pm Boris(Quote)
The simple fact is that both $cientology and Polaris are methods of parting as many people as possible from as much money as possible. In the process many of the victims are traumatised and scarred for life. Would you Pat, like to find out that your son or daughter had gone seriously into debt to finance their involvement with a so called religious technology, as the McBrides unfortunately had to discover following the suicide of their beloved son and brother. I certainly have a right and even a moral obligation to warn others about these scams. Maybe even a friend or relation of Pat’s will find enough information on these pages to avoid being ripped off as so many others already have been.
November 25th, 2009 at 10:39 pm wakeup(Quote)
Well said, Boris!
November 29th, 2009 at 1:13 pm Lisa(Quote)
Shane Krider is admitting he is a scientologist and he owns a personal development business in network marketing.
Enough Said
November 29th, 2009 at 2:19 pm Pat(Quote)
And I am a Catholic and I own a personal development business also. We all know Catholics have had their fair share of media spotlight too over the years, so come on people. At the end of the day everyone has a choice as to where they draw the line. One can run a business and not go down the religious road. Crikey, we have a cereal company called Hubbards that is Jehovah Witness. People still buy their cereal. I think it’s time people took responsibility for their OWN actions. It’s common knowledge that most human beings like to blame someone else if things don’t work out for them. At the end of the day though, we all make choices. If you chose to join a business and it didn’t work out for you, then that is a consequence of YOUR choice. A lesson learnt etc It has nothing to do with the religious origins of the founders at all. So grow up and take responsibility.
November 29th, 2009 at 4:04 pm Norman Kennedy(Quote)
A couple of other points about the guy blogging on here what is your name,maybe i missed it,Anyway your full of inuendo,Norman
November 29th, 2009 at 4:29 pm Norman Kennedy(Quote)
The Guy Who says he blogged this information is a big Lier”. Listen Lier,This is why,Liberty League was not involved with Sciencetology originaly Brent Payne Shane Krider had nothing to do with Scienctology,Only recently has Shane Krider has become involved with Scienctology,
You need to clean up your Knowlege,and stop using Inuendo for your unbelievable BS,I wonder if you are with Life Path??????? the company that copied Liberty League???? in the past,To imply that Brent Payne was in Scienctolgy is more of your inuendo BS,Norman
November 29th, 2009 at 5:34 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Hey Norman who are you referring to??
November 29th, 2009 at 5:47 pm Pat(Quote)
You make a very good point Norman. Yes indeed, if they WERE using the business as a front for scientology as the blogger assumes, then they would indeed have been in scientology first.
November 29th, 2009 at 6:04 pm Norman Kennedy(Quote)
Has anyone noticed that all the lies being published on here is from the same person,His name is “Billy Lier”Norman
November 29th, 2009 at 6:31 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
Did any of you see Lisa’s posting (might be in a different thread), Shane has been involved in scientology for a while, before PMG was made public knowledge. Shane claims that he has been working on PMG for 18 months, that is total BS. He may have been thinking about it for that long and trying to push Brent out for that long because he couldn’t do anything without Brent leaving.
Firstly if he had of been all these teething problems and products would be finalised including his systems and secondly I know for a FACT from people “close” to the source that this is why Brent left, he is just flat out not into scientology. That is why this is all happening so quickly and with so many problems, he could only make the change when Brent was pushed out in May 2009.
Also my advisor, part of the EMC, said at SS that Shane was happy now because he could take the business down a path that was in line with his beliefs and ideals. Little did we know those beliefs were scientology!
You can try and dress this up or down anyway you like but at the end of the day it was deceitful and wrong and I can tell you now the mass exodus is speaking for itself. Peoples feet are telling the story on how they feel!!
How many of you can actually say you know or are friends with scientologists but aren’t one yourselves?? Wont be many because they only associate with other scientologists and there is a reason for that!!
Also did you stop to wonder why Incomes Unlimited was shut down and not UWS??
November 29th, 2009 at 7:06 pm Pat Lever(Quote)
AHA! Got you on that last one “Cripes” I have very dear friends who are scientologists and who have been my friends for 10 yrs now. They’ve never pushed their beliefs on me ever. The live in las vegas. So you don’t know much at all do you about how they really work at all. It’s because of my friends that I know, Polaris as a business is no threat to me or anyone else. I think the question you need to be asking yourself is “why am I so scared of these guys”
Personally I think, that you are just plain scared of anything you don’t know enough about. You prefer to believe media hype over the years. It’s no different to the media telling us about a murder around the corner from where you live – would that then mean you have to sell up house and move straight away, or that the resale value of your property is going to drop never to come up again. You people are just drivel and that’s why you hide behind a non-de-plum. Grow up!
November 29th, 2009 at 7:33 pm Cripes!!(Quote)
AHA – you havent got me on anything, if you read my post properly I said “Wont be many because they only associate with other scientologists and there is a reason for that!!” note: Won’t be many, not none at all!!!! So just because YOU have one or two friends that are Sciti’s doesn’t disprove anything I said!!!!
Um I am not scared of these guys at all, disgusted but not scared!! I don’t read the media or watch tv news or anything like that and certainly don’t get caught up in the hype of anything! I have a brain in my head and can certainly make my own decisions to know for myself!!
Did you stop to think that maybe there are some of us that hide behind these names because of legal proceedings are in motion, moron!! Once this is done and dusted will be glad to come out with my real name!
November 30th, 2009 at 6:35 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Pat
Did Krider join Scientology before or after 09/09/09?
Beyond Freedom was/is in the process of being re-written as far as I know. The thus released components are new and the ones that haven’t been are presumably still being authored.
Therefore all of Polaris’ exisisting literature was produced under the helm of Scientology. Correct me if I’m wrong though.
November 30th, 2009 at 7:24 am Nameless(Quote)
@Oz… I believe it is safe to assume that Krider in Scientology prior to 09/09/09, the official launch date of the new PMG. We in the US were notified of the new company August 31 at the event in LA. Not sure how long this transition had been in the works prior to announcement, but the new company/products had to be developed.
As for the Beyond Freedom program, they are still selling the Beyond Freedom Classic, which was authored by Brent and Shane, until December 31st. Anyone who purchases the new Beyond Freedom Evolution Package (Departure, Decision, Action) is being shipped the OLD Beyond Freedom Classic until the new products are released in January, so they get a DEAL!
I don’t believe the BF Classic was produced under the helm of Scientology, but I could be absolutely wrong. However, the new BF Evolution most certainly is.
November 30th, 2009 at 7:53 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Ah fair enough then. I was under the impression some of the new BF was out while others weren’t.
I love the ‘we were working on Polaris Media Group for 18 months’ claim.
Over at the Arizona business records you can see under the Liberty League file that the name change to Polaris was put through on the 25/08/2009 (under the “ammendments” section). I was told by Fair Trading that they concluded their investigation into Liberty League in early May.
You can also see the name change document itself under the ‘scanned document’ section listed on the 25/08/2009.
Changing the name and structure of your company and then scrambling to finish a new product line, all one month after being declared a pyramid scheme by a regulatory body is a co-incidence?
I think not.
November 30th, 2009 at 7:58 am also the truth(Quote)
from what I understand the split began in Jan 08 when Brent was forced out . A little while later some of the big hitters started to leave. It was definately preplanned – a plan by Krider, Lavenia’s and Braxton. They are all Sciti’s.
Remember that Brent was not at Acapulco. I also dont think Beyond Freedom was written with a Sciti bent – but this next thing – writen by Krider/Lavenia – how could it not be.
November 30th, 2009 at 8:01 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Jan 08 – Aug 09 does put it at roughly 18 months then.
Perhaps as you said it was eventually planned to happen in their own time but due to the NSW DoFT investigation they had to rush it through early.
This fits in both with their 18 month story and the fact that the products aren’t even out yet.
November 30th, 2009 at 8:04 am iwonder(Quote)
(removed at the request of the author).
November 30th, 2009 at 8:04 am also the truth(Quote)
youre onto it OZ
November 30th, 2009 at 8:13 am iwonder(Quote)
Yes, and doesn’t that just drive you crazy.
If you cannot understand why this is done, I won’t get into an argument with you about it. No use.
(Oh, and by the way, the correct term is “nom de plume” LOL)
November 30th, 2009 at 8:25 am Nameless(Quote)
It was my understanding that Brent left this year around May. Something was said at the event in LA that this whole thing (company, Know for Yourself) was implemented in about a 4 week time-frame. Not sure if my memory is correct, but don’t know if I can find anyone to confirm that for me. They didn’t even have a written version of the comp plan prepared. They did a video presentation of the comp plan which was recorded directly at the event and only recently put it in writing and published it in .pdf format in the back office. No wonder we were all confused about it for so long. I think this whole changeover was done more hastily than people realize (it may have been in Shane’s mind much longer, though).
November 30th, 2009 at 8:27 am also the truth(Quote)
apolopgies OZ – I gave you the wrong yr – that should have reda Jan09
November 30th, 2009 at 8:32 am Cripes!!(Quote)
Spot on and then it was go time when BP was officially gone in May this year.
November 30th, 2009 at 8:39 am also the truth(Quote)
in my mind I see the change in the comp plan – a change in strategy to channel even more money into the “leaders” pockets. It was differcult previsouly to make money with the way it was – now with having to activate to make the higher 40% (lower than previous 60%) will result in even higher failure rates for the newbies – and where does the 40% balance go? I asked Gene Barxton on The GC – it goes into the other “funds” to be handed out to the “leaders”.
Its a blatant rip off.
You new guys reading this – how are you going to get poeple to talk to ? internet? – believe me that is a science! paper advertising? – forget it. You can get all hyped up about the ” Money” – from the EMC and the rest – but in real terms – it will be 200% harder than it was before, then anyone doing any research will find this blogg – being number one in the gooogle serach for PMG and they will be gone . -> the “leaders” will end up with your money – telling you that you “didnt take personal responsibility” or you were not “at cause” .
Get your focus off the BS figures thrown around by Ms Olliver and the like because those of us that are experienced – know that she is telling porkies – in a vain attempt to look after her own pocket.
November 30th, 2009 at 8:47 am RT