Why acknowledge traditional Aboriginal land owners?
The absurdity of the blanket acknowledgement of traditional Aboriginal land owners first hit me back in high school. I was in year seven from memory and it was an assembly marking the establishment of the school.
To kick start the assembly an acknowledgement was made to the traditional Aboriginal land owners of the area. As I sat in the audience watching this strange little ceremony I couldn’t help but wonder what, if anything, anyone was getting out of it.
Fast forward to 2010 and not much has changed.
Tony Abbott recently caused a bit of a stir when he had the balls to publicly raise what I suspect a lot of Australian’s have been thinking;
“Kevin Rudd is not an old-style lefty… but the Labor Party is full of people who are, and I guess this is the kind of genuflection to political correctness that these guys feel they have to make,” he said.
Mr Abbott cited Mr Rudd’s speech at last week’s Australian Medical Association parliamentary dinner in Canberra as an occasion at which a nod to the land’s traditional owners was inappropriate.
“There’s a place for this in the right circumstances but certainly there are many occasions when it does look like tokenism,” he said today.
Is acknowledging traditional Aboriginal landowners little more then a hollow token gesture?
I certainly think so. If you’re holding some event related to Aboriginals in particular then by all means pay your respects to the people that once roamed there. I don’t really care if you do or not but it’s your call to make.
If whatever it is that’s going on has absolutely nothing to do with Aboriginals or Aboriginal affairs, why exactly are we acknowledging them again? And why stop there, why not acknowledge the previous tenants of your residence the next time you hold a party.
Or hang a photo from the rear view mirror of the previous owner the next time you buy a second hand car.
It all does seem a bit silly.
As a young Australian the sentiment is completely hollow and beyond tokenism. It’s like saying grace at the table because your parents did despite you not believing a word of it.
Frankly I don’t really care who inhabited whatever land before I happened to be attending whatever formal ceremony was now being held on it. If they did nothing to contribute to the current state of events, other then running around hunting some kangaroos a couple of hundred years ago, then why do they deserve my recognition?
Yes the British could have handled occupation a bit better and it’s a tragedy that so many Aboriginal lives were lost but Aboriginals didn’t even have a system of land ownership to begin with. Get over it already.
In a similar vein of the abysmal state of Aboriginal welfare it seems traditional land acknowledgement is yet another example of modern day Aboriginals living in the past.
Naturally after stirring the bleeding heart hornet nest that is the cornerstone of latte politics in Australia, it didn’t take long for people to publicly disagree with Abbott’s remarks.
NSW Premier Kristina Keneally stated that
acknowledging traditional owners at official ceremonies is an appropriate way of recognising indigenous people
I’m more inclined to take advice from Aboriginal people, from elders, from our indigenous leaders, than I am from Tony Abbott on this subject.
“Yeah, no we’re right cheers.”
Of course Aboriginal leaders are going to support the continued show of recognition of their people, no matter how far removed from Aboriginal rights or relevence the event being held the recognition is presented at.
The question being raised isn’t whether they are comfortable with it but rather does it mean anything to the rest of the Australian population.
I mean traditional land ownership acknowledgement at an Australian Medical Association dinner… really?
Next in line to swing the bat was Curtin University Centre for Aboriginal Studies director Anita Lee Hong.
Hong made a public announcement calling for an apology from Abbott citing
It’s a way that non-Aboriginal people can show respect for Aboriginal people, building on our heritage and our ongoing relationship.
Then there’s the issue of respect being a two way street and all. I mean it’s not like non-aboriginal people do nothing to show respect towards Aboriginals. What exactly do Aboriginals do apart from going around telling the people of Australia ‘it’s not enough’ and demanding we pay them more money?
Why pretend like Aboriginals have a choice in the matter or that we’re actually going to listen to them if they objected to whatever event we asked them to attend and throw their blessing behind.
‘Sorry guys, we’ve had to call off this years Australian Medical Association dinner because the traditional land owners didn’t approve’.
Token acknowledgement indeed.
And what must it be like from an Aboriginal (non leader) perspective. It’d kind of be like Britain taking control of the Australian parliament and then requesting we attend every dinner party, afternoon tea or shopping mall opening to acknowledge the now defunct Australian parliament.
I don’t really see how modern day Aboriginals are benefiting from this acknowledgement at all. It’s not like we’re all going to forget who was living in Australia before the British arrived. I mean history is still taught in schools right?
If Aboriginals are worried people will forget they roamed Australia for 40,000 years before the British arrived then make it a question on our citizenship test or something. If you want acknowledgement as a race then how about doing something acknowledgeable.
Simply existing just doesn’t cut it.
March 17th, 2010 at 8:33 am lemmiwinks(Quote)
Terrificly un-pc post. I loved it!
If the Australian Aboriginals think they got a raw deal from the Poms they should be really glad that the Dutch took one look at the coast of WA and went “Nah, screw this place, it’s not for us.” Their colonial history shows they were not so generous to indigenous inhabitants. Same goes for Spain (find an Inca and ask them how well it went when they met up with the conquistadors).
March 17th, 2010 at 12:43 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Yeah you’re telling me. How many of the old colonial countries have been caught up in pumping so much into welfare to indigenous inhabitants with so little to show for it?
March 29th, 2010 at 2:33 pm jennaya(Quote)
I have to say I found your article quite offensive. To say that Inigenous people were doing nothing more than “running around hunting kangaroos” before we white people saved them, shows nothing of your knowledge, and everything about your ignorance.
Acknowledging the land that you are in is an Aboriginal tradition dating back thousands of years, and rather than a mere token of political correctness, it is a mark of respect to the traditional owners of that land.
I’m not even going to call you racist, because you would need some sort of knowledge of Australian history pre-1788 for that. You are just plain ignorant. I’m all for people expressing their opinions, as long as it’s an informed one. You my friend know nothing about anything you have just written about.
March 30th, 2010 at 1:10 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Well what exactly were they doing prior to the British arriving?
It’s not like they established cities, constructed cities or achieved any great scientific feats. They were just roaming the country killing animals for food were they not?
Well if Aboriginals want to acknowledge eachother then by all means do so. Why the hell do the rest of us have to, or have the government do so on our behalf?
First and foremost you should be Australian and then Aboriginal. As far as Australian customs go acknowledging people that ran about on the land before you were born isn’t a custom. Otherwise we’d all be doing it in instances that weren’t just purely token and catering to the Aboriginal population that don’t live there anymore.
March 30th, 2010 at 3:58 pm Cam(Quote)
Here’s something that might interest you. Aboriginals did not consider themselves ‘Landowners’ but rather they were part of the land itself.
So Terra Nullius really did belong to no-one!!
April 7th, 2010 at 12:32 am Gil(Quote)
I acknowledge the uninformed, uneducated, redneck, racist wowsers who comment on this page.
Do a bit of research before you open your uneducated, untutored, unschooled, untaught, uninstructed, unenlightened, uninformed, uncultivated, ignorant mouths. (def: Research. noun / diligent and systematic inquiry or investigation into a subject in order to discover or revise facts, theories, applications, etc.)
Indigenous people had customs, traditions, culture, morals, science, community, and system of governance. That it was different to the invading culture does not make it less meaningful nor unimportant.
Get an education!
April 7th, 2010 at 2:08 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
yada yada yada *massive yawn*. That’s a lot of words starting with un… seriously could you have tried harder to spout out token bleeding heart catchwords that address nothing, rebute nothing and contribute nothing to the discussion?
None of the Aboriginals alive today experienced this pre colonisation culture as it existed. Either we’re an Aboriginal country or we’re Australia, as it is today. Propping up a failed culture by pumping billions into welfare at the expense of the rest of the country is a joke.
We shouldn’t forget the history of this country or it’s people, but trying to psuedo sustain a half arsed way of life (crying about your culture whilst living in government housing, drinking yourself silly and relying on taxpayer handouts is not living ‘traditional aboriginal’) is not helping anyone.
Sure old Aboriginal customs are meaningful and important to Aboriginal elders and researchers (most young aboriginals today are too busy sniffing petrol or drinking to care about customs or their culture), but the rest of Australia doesn’t really seem to care. Why should the government on our behalf officially recognise who lived where 500 years ago everytime someone blows their nose?
April 13th, 2010 at 12:32 pm Sir Livesalot(Quote)
I can understand paying respect towards indigenous people but I don’t think I would call them Traditional Land Owners and I don’t think they deserve anymore respect then the next person from a different background.
I agree with the comment where the Aboriginal People regarded themselves as part of the land, however are they the only ones to lay claim to that title?
We are all part of the land and over time we all evolve, adapt and remember and when we all die we go back to the land. I would just acknowledge that we all exist on the land and are nothing more than caretakers and residents of the land, the “I was here first” argument is so old and so immature.
If we find they are not Traditional Land Owners can we sue them for misleading us and reclaim all the land titles that were given away ?
I suppose every country would like to have it’s own monarchy rule the land but in reality for the world to grow we all need to realise not one of us, past present or future are Traditional Land Owners unless we count all living things as a group of one.
And without showing respect to everyone how on earth are we supposed to grow as a planet when greedy or selfish people think they own the place and have done since day 000000000000001.
April 13th, 2010 at 1:56 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
With the one exception of providing blanket respect to everyone (I believe respect is earnt not granted), very well said!
The absurdity of acknowleding and respecting people who lived somewhere centuries ago isn’t going to get us anywhere.
June 7th, 2010 at 9:30 am Murray(Quote)
Sorry I’m a bit late to this chat. I was wondering if the writer of this piece has seen Avatar yet and, if so, whether s/he still has the same opinion?
For me, the concept of respect transcends race, gender, country, age and also time. We only have to look at what ‘white man’ has done to the Australian environment over the last 200 or so years to realise that a culture based on domination and ‘I’m right, you’re wrong’ is actually the source of our demise.
We are part of the landscape, but until we respect the landscape and each other, how can we actually move forward?
Can indigenous people really be criticised for trying to survive in the box we created for them after we intentionally attempted to destroy their culture that is so integrated in their spiritual connecttion to the land?
Stealing children from their families and re-educating them in missions and reserves, incarcerating those who stood up and tried to defend their people, and only recently throwing money in their direction as if that’s going to fix things – all sounds like a living nightmare to me.
Their culture, their hearts and the land that they live in have taken a huge battering.
If the tables were turned, we would really start to understand the horror of what has been done to these people over several generations. Then we would at least have respect for their resilience.
There are so many positive stories out there about what indigenous people are doing to resurrect their culture and our land so please don’t judge everyone by what you might think you understand when you see suffering souls trying to escape their plight at the bottom of a bottle. I’m sure I would be tempted to do the same if my culture and connection to the land had been systematically broken down.
Please see Avatar if you haven’t already and maybe it might help you unlearn what we were taught at school. You can only respect what is on the outside if you respect what is on the inside – they are one and the same. Until we all realise that, the future looks like a pretty grim place to me.
There is great wisdom in respecting the land and each other, and only eventual destruction in carving it up, exploiting its resources and ignoring the fact that we are part of our environment.
One day we will look back and realise how stupid ‘white man’ was – hopefully it won’t be too late to fix things by the time that day arrives.
June 8th, 2010 at 3:54 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
I’ve seen Avatar but the problem with the analogy is that in Avatar we were at the ‘invasion’ point so to speak.
Trouble with reality is that we’re well past that point now and no amount of whinging or money is going to take that back. Not to detract from what happened, but what’s done is done and the Australian population is never going to return to a nomadic lifestyle.
Not going to happen so get over it.
The current generation of Aborigines aren’t the same as the Captain Cook generation. Most have them don’t have any idea of their rich history or traditions and simply use what happened as a scapegoat to mask their own laziness and drug dependencies.
As much as I harbour environmental concerns of my own (I do my bit by recycling and riding a bicycle as much as I can), I’m not going to pretend like some rerevolutionary uptopia is just around the corner.
Aboriginals for the most part are dependent on welfare, they aren’t self sustaining so to make an Avatar movie comparison is kind of silly. Yes they were self reliant many decades ago and yes the government and people of the time changed that but we’ve more then repayed this debt financially.
Culturally I believe we’re at a point where the Aboriginals themselves have destroyed as much of their own culture as anyone else in this country did.
Personally I have no shame or feeling of responsibility over what happened. I wasn’t born during that time and my generation certainly has nothing to apologise for or feel guilty over.
June 27th, 2010 at 7:16 pm M.T Lain(Quote)
Here here. They had 40,000 years with the land & they achieved nothing. Other cultures achieved significantly more in the same time.
The native North Americans developed permanent camping sites (on a rotating basis), with a central area used for trade. Some traditions also developed a form of currency. The mayan and icans developed a form of culture & free standing rock building structures. There a handful of island cultures that developed not only these things, but also a banking system. Combine those with art and litrature & you’ve really got something (Aboriginal dot painting art is not so impressive when compared to other cultures of the same age).
I’m all for recognising excellence, but i don’t reward mediocrity & certainly don’t award a complete lack of cultural achievement.
Not much has changed. Thing is i blame our government. Too many damn hand outs is the problem. Why would you give up the free money, if the alternative is to go out and apply your self?
If i had my way i would take “are you aboriginal or torrestrate islander” off of government forms. You either Australian Citizen or you’re not (my taxes go to pay for Aboriginal Liason officers and other crap like that). An if you choose to not be an Australian Citizen you can be put straight into a reserve like they did with the native north americans (but without any of the mod-cons or government support, & no outside industry).
See how fast they decide that they prefer being citizens of an evolved society, rather then traditional savages.
-M
July 24th, 2010 at 9:03 pm ross dalrymple(Quote)
If they lived on the land as traditional landowners well then yes their would be no problem acknowledging them.I feel that they would get all the respect in the world if they did,because in truth they lived an exceedingly brutal and short life before the white man came, constantly at war with other tribes and each other.
You can still see this today with the feuding going on between the families and that is the only tradition that has survived to this day along with sharing all they have with the immediate family unit
August 10th, 2010 at 8:10 pm Wendy(Quote)
I often wonder what they (Aboriginals) have been doing for all those thousands of years too. I ask myself why they have not changed with the times like other countries & races have also. As someone else stated, they did not create anything like the Romans, Egyptians etc.., and to this day, find it almost impossible to survive without handouts, drugs, and booze.
Where I live, we are inundated with aboriginals. Thats fine- however- the racist comments thrown at ME, everytime I walk past them is very disturbing. They congregate in groups around our shopping mall, asking for cigarettes & money, while carrying a goon under their arms, stinking like last weeks fish dinner mixed with a cheap brew & sweat, and boy do they get irrate when told ‘no-’. They spit on you, call you white *unts, and any other name they see fit to call you.
They tell you to *uck off back to where we came from- yet I was born here, this is my home, they same as they were,no doubt.
Their homes are filthy, run down squalors, with no windows, graffiti adorning all the walls, and keep a multitude of dogs, that are skinny, and riddled with worms and goodness knows what else, putrifying the soil. Any help offered to them in the way of repairs is usually destroyed by that night.
How can they say, they are about the land, when they insist on destroying everything ‘given’ to them? Why are they allowed to use such horrendous racial slur in respect to white Australians, yet continue to say WE are the ones who are racist?
Why is it, that the kids never go to School? They even have their own Aboriginal Schools, but most are almostempty- they even have their own School buses, yet my kids have to walk 4km’s everyday to and from School?
I suppose, if welfare removed their children for neglect and non-compliance- they would once again scream RACISM! I’m afraid, if it were a white person doing the same thing, those kids would also be removed, so it isn’t a racist thing if the children are removed for their own safety.
The Government should take a stronger stand on Aboriginal children that are not at School..cut the families welfare off- you’ll see the kids rocking up to School ten-fold then…
I also wonder, why they say we have taken all THEIR land, when they are quite free to return to the bush and live like their forebarers, however, there would be no dole or pension, which means no beer and drugs, so they have CHOSEN not to return to traditional ways..
It is no wonder many do not work,as they do not finish School, and they ARE given many opportunities to do so, as they receive massive amounts of funding..they need to realise this is why they are not getting jobs, NOT because of their colour..who cares what colour they are!
Where I live, they are drunk by 10am in the Morning, and this is our fault? Imagine refusing them the chance of buying alcohol, to try to help them out? You’d be shot.
I, like many others, are getting fed up with their racism, demands, and free ride through life, when we have to work everyday, to keep our families afloat. How many times must we say sorry to them, before it sinks in? If my History lessons at School serve me correct, the British DID try to associate with the Aboriginals when they first arrived on Australian shores, but they were met with spears, and hatred, so of course, there was retaliation on the British soldiers part..and, times were much different back then, compared to now, aboriginals need to realise, that sort of thing does not happen now, it is history, and it is now time to move on, and build a new life for themselves, like the African Americans have done.
Sadly, too few Aboriginals have changed over the last 200 years, and refuse to do so, so they will always be at the bottom of the chain, so to speak, by THEIR choice.
They want equality, then MAKE them behave equal..MAKE them stay at School, or cut their dole/pensions, as would happen to us..MAKE them take care of their homes, or kick them out- as would happen to us..make THEM responsible for their actions, as we must do, and on top of all things- make them accountable for their racist slur’s..because we sure as heck wouldn’t walk up to them, and call them horrid names in regards to THEIR colour to their race and colour!
August 29th, 2010 at 1:10 pm Si(Quote)
Here’s an address by Paul Keating that summerises nicely what I would like to include in these discussions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhqAFLud228&feature=player_embedded
August 30th, 2010 at 12:54 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Wow there’s a lot of ‘we’s’ in that speech. What a crock, none of the Aboriginals listening to that speech were dispossessed or owned any land or faced any of the colonisation experiences.
Talk about pandering to and feeding the victim mentality, no wonder they’ve always got their hands out asking for more.
September 15th, 2010 at 6:53 pm Tbird(Quote)
Disgusting.
Learn your history before you rant about it.
September 24th, 2010 at 3:52 pm Beck(Quote)
This article and some of the subsequent posts might be the worst, most overtly racist thing I have ever read.
October 4th, 2010 at 11:22 am Megan(Quote)
Well, it’s helped me make up my mind whether or not to do the whole acknowledgement thing at an event where I’m the MC.
October 5th, 2010 at 2:17 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Out of curiosity Megan, what type of event was it and what was your final decision?
October 5th, 2010 at 12:01 pm Megan(Quote)
I can’t say I agree completely with all your comments, but do agree that it is simply tokenism since the indigenous people didn’t ever claim to own the land as they were nomadic.
I decided not to do the acknowledgement as the event was a tourism launch and this had nothing to do with aboriginal people or their culture.
However, two people of aboriginal descent came along, so I changed my mind. I did ask the aboriginal man if he would like to do a Welcome to Country, but he declined as he said that the place where we were wasn’t his people’s land, even though he is of the same tribe who once stayed around here.
I believe if we are going to acknowledge the ‘traditional owners’, then we should acknowledge all those who came after them, opened up the land and started producing food crops to feed the world, all those who started industries and created wealth to make our country what it is today.
Thanks for the discussion, I’ll be reading more of your soapbox blog.
October 5th, 2010 at 4:41 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
This brings up an interesting point. That being that if there are no Aboriginals in the audience, does acknowledging them become any more or less relevant or important. Are we acknowledging them for their sake or ours?
So if there were no Aboriginals in the audience, you wouldn’t have acknowledged them right? On the other end of the spectrum it’s kinda like a comedian not telling racist jokes after learning that members of his or her audience are of that race.
I’m not suggesting token acknowledgement is racist but the principle is the same, be it in reverse.
I’m glad to hear the ‘Welcome to Country’ was knocked back, although would have been nice to hear it wasn’t necessary rather then it wasn’t their land.
No worries, glad to have you as a reader.
November 14th, 2010 at 7:24 pm hi(Quote)
It’s “hear, hear” and Torres Strait. Btw, your capitalisation is inconsistent.
It’s ‘than’,not ‘then’. You did that in your article as well. No comment about your education, but just Google it and get it right, everyone makes mistakes.
ozsoapbox, I’ll try to be short and sweet.
I’m not 100% sure, but I think they don’t have such selfish ideas as land ‘ownership’ because they believed that they could coexist with their environment, not steal the resources as if they were inexhaustible like we are.
Personally, I think their society was far superior to the wasteful one you live in and just because the British invaded them does not mean they have to completely lose their way of life. And if you say “Get over it” one more time, I ask you a question,
If your grandmother died, how would you feel if I told you to just get over it? It was the past. You might say you would still be grieving but what if the Aboriginal people are still grieving their losses? Get over it?
Another point I want to make, don’t be an ignorant little brat by saying if you didn’t cause it, you have no responsibility over it. Another rhetorical question:
If you didn’t cause global warming, but you think it’s wrong that we don’t do anything about it, is it alright to just say “Whatever!” and not do anything?
Or is poverty a better example?
If I didn’t make those people poor, should I just sit back and remark how you weren’t born into it.
And to those who complain about Aboriginal youth. Yes, there are some who need help but is it really in your capacity to say they’re taking your money. Why aren’t YOU doing anything to help them personally so that they don’t continue to take your money? Too lazy? Just pay taxes and wait for the government to take the load?
Give them a chance to change. Just don’t be a spoilt asshole about it.
Sorry if my view is uninformed, uneducated, etc… but I don’t like your passive-aggressive way of showing your opinion.
November 15th, 2010 at 2:15 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Thanks for that, because y’know… one spellling mistake is an accurate representation of someone’s education. Then/than is just one of those mistakes I make quite commonly. It’s been pointed out before and since then I’ve made a concentrated effort to use the correct spelling.
Would you go and live running around naked in the outback?
Didn’t think so. Face it, for all it’s short comings modern society with all its luxuries beats the crap out of a nomadic lifestyle.
If I was demanding billions in welfare and carrying on with the ‘woe is me mantra’ then yeah, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if people told me to ‘get over it’.
People have lost their grandparents all over the world and gotten on with life, it’s simply not an excuse or justification to continue binge drinking and child abuse.
Strawman argument. Global warming is an ongoing event. All the stuff the Aboriginals whinge about happened before most current generation Australians, including the Aboriginals whinging, were even born.
A better analogy would be that if the governments around the world worked together to get our emissions down to sustainable levels, would it then make any sense to further damage economies and pump billions into further combating global warming?
I don’t believe there is anything to say sorry for and I haven’t a shred of guilt in me as far as Aboriginal welfare goes. If anything, they’ve
stolenbeen given far more from the Australian people economically then I personally will ever take from them.I’ll do my bit by voting for any government who hopefully one day sends the wakeup call that enough is enough.
Yeah, let’s all go help the drunk drugged up teenagers. That’ll work well.
Even the cops get attacked when they go around, I’m sure Johhny non-aboriginal will get a rip roaring welcome reception. Great idea.
November 16th, 2010 at 7:16 pm hi(Quote)
Try not to use sarcasm in text (if you were being sarcastic); it doesn’t really work. Anyway, good debate! Now I’ll leave you alone to let you live your meaningless life!
November 17th, 2010 at 1:36 am ausGeoff(Quote)
This comment is very typical of others claiming that our Aboriginals had some sort of deep and meaningful, and spiritual understanding of the land they invaded.
But…
When the Aborigines arrived in Australia, the country had a diverse range of very large and unique mammals, now usually referred to as “megafauna”. These animals disappeared soon after the arrival of the Aborigines, and ultimately, the Aborigines’ effect on the environment was devastating.
Most scientists (including, surprisingly, Prof. Tim Flannery) believe that their extinction was due either directly or indirectly to the arrival of the aborigines. The animals, of course, were so unafraid of man that the Aborigines were able simply walk up to them and kill them.
Scientists also believe that the fire farming introduced by Aborigines changed the environment in a way that eventually led to the total extinction of the megafauna.
The disappearance of this megafauna made a huge difference to the history of Australia. This is because some of them would’ve been prime candidates for domestication, and with domesticated animals would have come a whole new development path for Aborigines. At the time, domestication had proved hugely successful in other continents. However, with the extinction of the megafauna in Australia, Aborigines were left with no readily domesticable animals at all.
By the time the white man arrived in Australia, the small population (300,000) of Aborigines was already consuming the majority of animal protein in Australia and, through fire farming, was almost certainly effectively wasting more of the edible grasses and grains than all the other herbivores combined. With both domesticated animals, and crops, the Aborigines’ lives could have been far more sustainable.
In fact, during their period of sole occupancy of Australia, the Aborigines caused the extinction of far more species than the white man has.
Really? What a bizarre conclusion.
December 31st, 2010 at 1:39 am Cait(Quote)
THANK YOU!!!!
I am beginning to write my submission to the most repressive initiative, the Draft Flora and Fauna Strategy, the Yarra Ranges Council in Vic has ever had written for them by dubious greeny types.
And like everything else they do, it begins with them acknowledging the ‘Traditional Owners’.
That the Council does this ticks me off to no end. When the Aboriginies start paying all the back rates they owe, then they can claim to be ‘traditinal owners. Until then, tough.
The council also puts a picture of that ridiculous flag on the page. I hate it. The Council NEVER has the Australian flag anywhere in their documents, but ‘flies’ the aboriginal flag in every one of them.
And I can never remember which term to call them – aboriginies or aboriginals. I don’t know why we just can’t call ‘em ‘abos’.
Ozsoapbox, I really enjoyed reading you’re post, and Wendy, loved your comment.
AusGeoff, what you have written needs to be taught to every school child.
And whatever happend to the ‘ORIGINAL OWNERS’ of the land, the Mungo people? Or the Negritos? Or the pygmies that lived near Cairns? Why have they gone missing from the textbooks?
It’s shameful that the ancient anthropological history of Australia is nothing more than a pc political football that has nothing to do with science.
December 31st, 2010 at 7:44 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
Ugh, this sort of mandatory acknowledgement is exactly what I was talking about. If I was working there I’d be actively working towards getting the council to ask why it does so.
If it’s an issue related to land ownership then fair enough, but what does slapping the acknowledgement (and Aboriginal flag wtf?) on every document achieve?
June 27th, 2011 at 10:31 am Nicola(Quote)
Ozsoapbox, you bring up good points. Why should we say the welcome to country? Especially when no one even fully understands what it’s meaning is.
Todays youth are made to feel ashamed about what was done in the past, and I feel that my class mates and I do feel ashamed, we certinally wouldn’t do what our forefathers did and now we want to make emends, but how can we do that when we don’t even understand the full extent of what has been done?
I think that we need to be properly educated on the subject so we can fully understand the extent of our ansesters actions so we can actually mean it when we say the welcome to country.
I personally am all for saying it, what is wrong with simply acknowledging the ‘original custodians’ of Australia? It’s not like they are asking us to stand on our heads and resite our whole family tree and what our family members did to their family members, it’s simply saying I acknowledge that you were living here perfectly content until we came along.
It takes around 2 seconds max to listen to it, its really not that hard. (it obviously takes more that 2 seconds, i was just trying to imply it takes up a very short time)
On the other hand, better wording should be used to give the proper acknowledgement to the aboriginals.
I mean no offence to anyone by commenting on this, i simply feel the need to express my thoughts as a young australian to those who also feel the need to discuss the topic.
Thank you for your time.
June 27th, 2011 at 3:07 pm ross dalrymple(Quote)
Welcome to country! What a load of crock! whose country? Arent we all Australians living in a multicultural Australia?
I just don’t get it, aboriginal people expect white people to feel ashamed of what their forefathers did. Our forefathers did what they had to do to survive, if aboriginals stole they were punished if they waged war they got war According to archaeology palaeontology ect…
Thousands of years ago their aboriginal forefathers committed genocide on the previous inhabitants of this country (the negritos) I don’t hear them saying sorry about that!!!
Im a 3/4th generation Aussie with Irish Scottish ancestry and when I see a white guy with more Irish blood than aboriginal painted up and doing a corroboree it just shows it up for what it is, a farce.that’s like me going to Scotland dressed in a kilt doing the highland fling and telling them welcome to MY country.
June 28th, 2011 at 1:30 pm ozsoapbox(Quote)
@Nicola
And herein lies the problem.
If your grandfather or parents murdered someone would you feel directly responsible or guilty about it? Shame implies that you’ve done something to be ashamed of.
So what exactly have Australians living today done to feel ashamed about? You can acknowledge what happened perfectly fine without feeling all guilty and ashamed about it.
Welcome to country is nothing more than tokenism which, as you acknowledge means little to today’s generation.
July 2nd, 2011 at 1:15 pm Rayzor(Quote)
I am quite proud to be called an invader even when I not even British. I am an Australian. Bitza mix. My question is Why are they still here?
Perhaps you can call me Rayzor The Barbarian or Rayzor the Conquer. Or King Rayzor of Gondwanaland Or Rayzor Lord of the Quinkan men. Either on would be nice.
I am a master of pointing the bone kapow!
September 15th, 2011 at 4:00 am Almica(Quote)
This is just how I feel, and I’m glad to see everyone feels the same and has made such good points making me realise I am not alone. I also see the few who don’t understand and are just copying the propaganda of being PC are really.. well.. dumb.
Comparing the aboriginals behaviour to saying my grandmother died is the worst analogy second the global warming one. My grandmother did die, and oneday my mum will, and so will I, and it will be sad. Many sad things will happen and that is life. My great great great great etc ancestors also died, and i’m sure many went through extremely hard times (living in the desert in the 1800′s would of sucked) being shipped here as a prisoner and all, and then having to build the railroads and wander for miles without food or water in an extreme climate. wow.
I know my recent ancestors went through bad times (rape, abuse, poverty) and I don’t know the extent of it, I have no records. But I am sure the older times were even worse. But my genes survived, so I should be grateful and so should all the aborigines who might of died otherwise by disease or an inquisition, and same goes for you.
Most other natives didn’t get off so easy. The aussies/old british that did come here however- as being deported, didn’t even want to come here, and they made friends with the natives cause they couldn’t navigate the land. Both were trying to survive. It was no picnic for anyone. But obviously it worked out because australia is a great country, high literacy rate, clean water, health care, technology, secular, multi cultural and modern!!…
I mean look at this, its so easy and happy compared to places that are war torn and ridden with problems. Why complain? We brought medicine, technology, clothes, food, clean water, sewage, housing, aircon, cars… EVERYTHING! You wanna hate on us for bringing you this??
This makes me sad for what our ancestors worked for, only to be discriminated against, only to be reminded of a bad incident compared to the positives that overwhelm the bad things. The stolen generation was only about 100 people, and they were put into rich family homes, with servants included.
Funny how much damage has happened in history overseas, what other countries have done but they dont even mention it (look at africa, india, china, america who has inavded everyone!) but our australian youth must be reminded everyday how being white is bad. Why don’t we all sit here and cut our wrists for being white? what a joke.
The south americans have proudly claimed their land, they never speak of the aztecs. Why do we have to?? I wouldnt even mind it, if I got some respect and wasn’t persecuted for the colour of my skin.
I hate hearing others, like aboriginies and the old black argument.. saying they “lost touch” with their spirituality as though that means something. You choose to be spiritual (whatever that means, religious, hippie?? Pagan?? Shaman? god knows!) you aren’t born into it, and weve all see the devasting effects of religion anyway (look at the middle east) so really I have no idea what my ancestry was “spiritually” but I can take a guess (some kinda pagan, catholic, protestant thing) and I’m glad I was born open minded and not indoctrinated.
I accept this, however others do not, they wear it like baggage making everyone feel bad for them for “losing something”, but what?! it means nothing!
I bet if you were never even told that as a kid about “lost spirituality” and false entitlement, you wouldnt even think of it. Cause we don’t. Self pity is learned. It is dogma, and it is reverse racism. Black children are taught to hate white people- doesnt matter if you’re a new immigrant from russia, germany, italy, england, or anywhere that is irrelevent to the old settlers, you are still discriminated against. Even us aussies have no control over the past.
I hate that “Hi” person who moronically stated that “even if you have nothing to do with something, you are still responsible for it.” That doesnt even make sense! How does that make sense?
Ugh, you could use that to deny responsibility by just pushing it onto someone else. It’s such hypocrisy! The aboriginals use that in order to AVOID responsibility, and its not for us to claim. The only person responsible is his or herself.
If something directly happens to you such as rape or abuse, then yes you can hate that person, but that was a personal experience. You can’t hate a whole group of people judging by their LOOKS, about some story you heard and have made your own.
Its just another old story that gets emotion attached to it, but if you were never told it, it wouldn’t bother you. If someone told me about my great great grandma’s hardship and said I can blame my next door neighbour cause his great great x 10 grandfather abused her, that would be irrational and insane.
However the aboriginals and bleeding heart hippies advocate this, mainly for money. Its a sinking ship and they are not ready to stand on their own feet, its about money and nothing else. Its like trying to take money away from a spoilt adult who never worked- they wouldn’t know how to cope, so they manipulate you.
Getting handouts is not about respect or the future, and it is SO far removed from anything “spiritual”. Asking for money and free cars and houses, and spending it on drugs and “gangsta” gear is so materialistic. How cultured is that, exactly? It’s pathetic.
How much more money do they want before they start being cultured? LOL. it will only get worse. The money handouts do not work, and more money wont help.
By the way, aboriginals are not Gangsta. Gangsta’s have guns and fight for their own money, they are gangstas because they do not get handouts. People’s stupidity does my head in, and there are so many more things I could point out that are inconsistent, yet ignored.
I grew up with aboriginals as a child (they are now drug dealers, Iv’e finished my psychology degree) and my godmother is aboriginal, my ex stepdad is an activist for them too. My step mum is Jamaican. I have no issue with race, and thats why I can see clearly and have no fear.
All I was ever taught was good things about other races, yet as a white I have seen a lot of predjudice towards us. I learnt that the ones who propagate this, are the aboriginals, because of their entitlement bullshit.
African and Indian and chinese immigrants live all over here, everywhere, and they come from actual fucked up countries, work their asses off and they do fine! They don’t sit around saying someone stole “their land”. just like I don’t bang on the front door of my great great great grandpas house and say “This my land, yo white dawg cunt”. It would be disgraceful, and stupid.
You should all watch Blood Diamond, and see what actual warfare is. THATS land stealing. The holocaust. The Hiroshima Bomb. Seriously guys, wake up! You think aboriginals got it bad? Shit, they have it FUCKING EASY.
By the way, avatar is more relevant to a place like the Middle east. If you guys are so concerned with people’s welfare, how about you work on things happening now, that far exceed the tragedy of the past.
There is a war going on, millions have died. Millions are also in slave trade around the world. Girls are being circumsized in africa, and in even in australia/america/england in secret by their families, cause its illegal here. Women are being killed and beaten everyday in islamic countries.
Everyday 1500 women die from childbirth.
Every 3 years one million people die from smoking.
Seriously people, wake up. This is a big world, and bad things happen. Humans are scary, disease is scary, nature is scary, and the universe is even more unpredictable. A comet could hit at any time. No warnings are given because it only causes chaos, thats a fact.
We are all mortal, and none of us own the land. We need the eco system to support us, and over population is proof of our arrogance and ignorance. Food is getting scarcer and more expensive (bread is the easiest to harvest, protein isnt, thats why we are all sick and overweight, shit food is cheaper) and because we are breeding so fast and basically everyone is selfish, and everyone from aboriginals to africans, europeans, indians, asians… all of us will fight ourselves to get our own way, no matter how damaging it may be.
Us humans arent that clever you see. We are driven by emotions (the aboriginal thing is proof of emotions winning over logic) our primal urges to consume, have sex and breed, regardless of what is rational.
This is what will cause mass famine and wars over resources. If we cant come to terms with the aboriginal bullshit, what hope is there for real issues?
None of us own anything. Life isn’t a battle of owning the most toys. Life is about simply surviving, but people don’t think about that. we die empty handed. Remember that. I am a 21 year old white person, and I have more ‘wisdom’ than a typical aboriginal, only cause I chose to be informed, but you can’t say all whites are greedy, ignorant etc, cause lots of us are nothing like that. I was not raised to be greedy, only to be intelligent and to have just enough to be happy.
You can be a surviver, or you can be a failure. You can stand up and make the most of your blessings or you can whinge cause clean water, health care, clothing, a home and education aren’t enough.
Immigration has become a huge issue, and overpopulation concerns me more than the abos welfare. Our economy knows that if we are going to deal with the immigrants we need to start telling the aboriginals “sorry, party is over, Australia is in debt to the Federal Reserve, we have to house refugees, and its killing us having to pay you too, when so far you have done nothing.”
Teach a man to fish, feed him for life. Feed him for one day, he will go hungry tomorrow. well we have tried, we have TRIED FOR YEARS! Nothing has gotten better, only worse through handouts. Greater issues are at hand now, and once the money stops, the abos will wake up to reality and will get off the booze, cause they will HAVE TO if they want to work and survive. I wish I could party everyday too, but I can’t!
if australia ever went down hill, and went broke, the aboriginals would die first, cause they are so reliant and cant sustain themselves. plus No invader would ever spare those hopeless drunkards. But the aboriginals dont see how lucky they are to live in this place, not tibet or africa or india or russia, or thailand.. you name it. They would be dead, or would shape up.
We can’t force aboriginals to want to learn, just like you cant force a drug addict to stop, or a depressed person to wake up. That has to come from inside you. I get depressed, but I realised that change must come from me. so I know what its like to be helpless despite being beautiful, thin, popular etc. I know how it is to want more. and trust me, you will find someone to blame if you want to. But I accept it, and I can’t blame anyone for my state of mind. I have to get on with life, or fail.
Aboriginals never have to face that kind of maturity though. we all have obstacles. Some of us may seem like we have it all, but we don’t. We do not go around telling people though. We hide it, we hide our struggles and hope it goes away.
Do you really think being white is easier? Do you really think being an ugly, poor white person is better than being a successful black person?
Being white doesn’t make you any better. White people (and asians, and afro-americans, mexicans etc) usually just have to be, cause we work. or else we lose a job. White people just ACT okay, but we have tragedies that no one gives a shit about.
My grandfather was a street kid, he ran way from home from his alcoholic dad after his mother (my great grandma) stabbed herself to death. He found her when he came home from school and left. It would of been traumatic, and he never speaks of it and is just fine!
He got married when he was 20, and studied while looking after his kids (my mother one of them) and he founded the Leukemia Foundation and many other very famous charities, and was the CEO of Telethon in the 80′s. so people can overcome things. He “got over it”, so to say. I thank my ancestors for being resilient.
THAT is strength, and whoever said “aboriginals are resilient” is a moron. in what way are they resilent? Surviving the Hiroshima Bomb is strength, being a hobo cause you can’t get a free house is fucking pathetic. So far Ive only seen disintergration, not reslience, and they have no one to blame but their OWN ancestors. The babies of these aboriginals now, can only blame their crack pot parents for their situation. I would.
I thank my ancestors for being strong and overcoming so much, I hope my own problems can be solved so I can be a good mum too. If I was a drug addicted scum bag I would never bring an innocent child into it. The aboriginal woman who lived a few houses down from me had 20 kids, yes 20. The enormous, beautiful stone house (that was given to them) became a drug lab.
so I have seen it all, I have stood back and assessed it. Everything is refuted by now. There is no good argument for aboriginals stealing our money, not for us or them, and it furthers their poverty, and our secret resentment towards them and their invalid hatred towards us.
so for all your bullshit analogies, I have a life story to tell that proves we are each responsible for ourselves.
I wonder if my children, and grandchildren, will have to endure this kind of bull shit too, and be taunted for being white? You had better think about your effects on the future.
as for the land ownership and the energy wasted on such a trivial debate, Life of Brian put it best:
We all die. Money, land.. whatever you want: nothing saves you. nothing stops time, nothing stops nature and death. We are all mortal and should enjoy our time here because oneday things will be worse. Lost land is nothing, be grateful you are alive today. Cause you never know when it will be over.
September 15th, 2011 at 4:13 am Almica(Quote)
that was a huge comment, but it was hard to write one thing and leave out something else. I guess I just wanted to sum it all up in one go. Especially in these topics, you all need to understand where I am coming from as a person, how I am not racist yet why I feel as though people judge me as being “superior” cause I am white, and people project their own insecurities onto me. I don’t know why, and it hurts.
Everytime I say simply that aboriginals shouldnt get benefits, people think I’m ignorant (but really they are, ironically) so I had to explain all my reasons why I’m actually very open minded and I know what I feel is right, cause I have seen it for myself.
I have been robbed by rich white-aboriginals at a catholic school when I was 15 (all my weeks wages were stolen, when your 15 thats very heartbreaking), because they have been influenced by that culture. They did it cause they could, cause they are aboriginals.
They were PAID to go to school, and were rich anyway! But took my money, and called me names because I was white, blue eyed and attractive (I guess, even though they were pretty too) until it got so bad I left. so even the rich ones ride that wave cause they fucking CAN.
Do I get reparations for that? Nup.
Its reverse racism, and everyone who is a self hating white here, has ever actually known them like I have. lived around them. I promise you that. They aren’t poor suffering souls, they are naughty kids. They are just like spoilt kids. Nothing deep there at all, trust me I have tried to look.
No substance, no culture, no education about other nations or foreign wars. They dont care for anyone else but themselves
September 15th, 2011 at 11:07 am ozsoapbox(Quote)
Thanks for sharing all that Almica. Some great insight there that you’re definitely not going to get from the late city crowd who defend policies like traditional land acknowledgement as if their lives depended on it.
September 15th, 2011 at 12:47 pm Megan(Quote)
Almica, you sound well qualified to make those comments.
The picture you paint for our country sounds pretty dire, I would hope that things don’t get that bad.
The ‘reverse racism’ you mention is so prevalent in a large town near where I live. Young white people are terrified of aboriginal gangs and keep well out of their way.
The thing I find incredible is that all the take away Bottle Shops in that particular town close down when there’s an aboriginal funeral. The entire community and those in surrounding areas are inconvenienced because the aboriginal people cannot control themselves. They drink themselves into a stupor, then fight each other.
And where do they get the money to buy all this grog? From welfare payments which come from our taxes.
Perhaps the government will have to apologise in years to come for giving them the money because it led to alcoholism and destruction of families.
September 15th, 2011 at 4:28 pm ausGeoff(Quote)
Thanks for your informative, detailed input Almica… phew—what a read LOL.
Having lived and worked in rural WA (Port Hedland and Kalgoorlie) I know all about “reverse racism” too.
—Cheers.
March 20th, 2012 at 12:00 pm sigh so sad(Quote)
i take offence to the generalisation that australias “first people” constantly have to put up with. they are not all alcoholics laying around in the streets waiting for the next government hand out, which is the picture i get when i see such comments as yours.
Why should you put down a race of people who have survived displacement, dispossession and genocide yet who will still extend the hand of friendship.
Would you rather they be aggressive and militant like other countries to receive any respect. I’ve seen white children wandering the streets of perth and sleepin under the bridges because they have been kicked out and disowned by thier families.
ive seen white youths strung out on drugs and sitting in doorways and not one person stopped to help, the society that has been built is not wonderful for everyone but who cares right?
alcohol, drugs, greed and a lot of chronic diseases did not exist in australia prior to colonisation yet they are the very things that are killing off indigenous australians.
the average australian aboriginal has a shortened life expectancy than non indigenous people.
dont even know why im takin the time to address such ignorance but it made my blood boil…
my wish for you is that you wake up tomorrow and find out your aboriginal…..
March 20th, 2012 at 8:37 pm ausGeoff(Quote)
I can agree with this and still see the contrary situation…
Of course, they’re not ALL alcoholics; it’d be naive to truly believe that. What we are saying is that there’s far, far too many aborigines who waste their lives drifting aimlessly through their days with no ideals or goals or aspirations… or future. And, again, far too many aborigines do rely on their fortnightly, taxpayer-funded welfare handouts.
“Displacement” and “dispossession”? Accepting that this did actually occur, what’s the difference? Or are you simply trying to reinforce your argument with tautologies? And “genocide”? Are you one of these people that are still blaming us whites—200 years down the track—for the actions of our great-great-great grandfathers? You must be kidding surely?
And the “hand of friendship”? Why—if indeed such a concept exists—is it that it’s inevitably us whites that have to extend this hand? Having lived and worked amongst two large large Aboriginal populations in north-western WA, I can honestly say that no aboriginal person ever initiated contact with me in the streets. Well, apart that is from the occasional threat to punch my lights out if I didn’t give them some smokes or money for cheap booze.
And these are both “straw man” arguments…
Are you really suggesting that because an infinitesimal percentage of us whites are homeless druggies or hopeless alcoholics that this somehow excuses the massive percentage of the Aboriginal population who are? Nope; doesn’t make any sense.
These assertions are somewhat over-generalised too…
You’re obviously unaware that the first smallpox epidemic amongst aborigines was due to its introduction into Australia by Macassan fishermen (from Indonesia) and nearby islands who landed on our northern coast prior to European settlement.
And you’re also unaware that it wasn’t European settlers who introduced alcohol to the aborigines—which is a common myth. They were actually producing their own alcoholic drinks from plants such as Quandong, Corkwood and Pandanus way before the white man appeared on the scene.
In fact, it’s more than apparent you don’t really know anything much at all about Aboriginal social history. Well, apart from the misinformation that the bleeding-heart leftie luvvies are feeding you.